Re: Wyoming

[Wyocaddis]

9mm, 40 S&W, 45ACP, 10mm, are not legal in Wyoming to hunt big game with! 38 special 357 and above are go figure A little more to it but get the point. Straight from Wyoming Game and Fish.

[sep]

Sounds like somebody should petition them to reconsider the 10mm and ditch the 38 special for big game. Maybe nobody has brought the issue before them before?   

[sqlbullet]

They specify minimum caliber and cartridge length, OR minimum caliber and energy @ 100 yards.

For the first one .35 cal or larger with a COAL of 1.5 or greater.  38 Special makes the cut because SAAMI spec of 38 special is 1.550" COAL.  However, as you correctly identify most 38 special loads fall far short of the desired muzzle energy for successful big game hunting.

I think 10mm Auto actually would meet the requirement with heavier bullets based on energy.  They state "Cartridges that generall deliver 500 ft-lbs of impact at 100 yards.  A 200 grain XTP loaded to 1250 fps delivers 507 ft-lbs at 100 yards and therefore would make the cut.  Out of a G40 or 6" 1911, this is very attainable energy for a 10mm

http://www.huntwyo.com/blog/new-weapon-regulations-for-hunting-in-wyoming/

However, this does illustrate the challenges law makers and game directors face when codifying requirements. Making a list of cartridges is problematic because new cartridges are introduced all the time.  Dimension based requirements open the door to old cartridges that are low pressure or low efficiency that may not deliver the ideal energy.  Terminal specification based approaches are generally a good compromise, but still results in issues as illustrated here when only certain loads will meet the ballistics requirement.  A 155 grain 10mm  won't carry enough energy to 100 yards where a 200 grain will.  How is a game officer to tell which load you have?

[Wyocaddis]

They specify minimum caliber and cartridge length, OR minimum caliber and energy @ 100 yards.

For the first one .35 cal or larger with a COAL of 1.5 or greater.  38 Special makes the cut because SAAMI spec of 38 special is 1.550" COAL.  However, as you correctly identify most 38 special loads fall far short of the desired muzzle energy for successful big game hunting.

I think 10mm Auto actually would meet the requirement with heavier bullets based on energy.  They state "Cartridges that generall deliver 500 ft-lbs of impact at 100 yards.  A 200 grain XTP loaded to 1250 fps delivers 507 ft-lbs at 100 yards and therefore would make the cut.  Out of a G40 or 6" 1911, this is very attainable energy for a 10mm

http://www.huntwyo.com/blog/new-weapon-regulations-for-hunting-in-wyoming/

However, this does illustrate the challenges law makers and game directors face when codifying requirements. Making a list of cartridges is problematic because new cartridges are introduced all the time.  Dimension based requirements open the door to old cartridges that are low pressure or low efficiency that may not deliver the ideal energy.  Terminal specification based approaches are generally a good compromise, but still results in issues as illustrated here when only certain loads will meet the ballistics requirement.  A 155 grain 10mm  won't carry enough energy to 100 yards where a 200 grain will.  How is a game officer to tell which load you have?

What I thought too. The 500 ft ibs. no longer carries any weight 35 cal. and above 1.5" OAL or above ( how the 38 made it is beyond me) Officers now carry laminated cards with a list of cartridges one side yes other side no. There is no judgement as to ballistics. So as an example could carry old black powder 44 special Legal, Modern 10mm not.

[Wyocaddis]

Quote Wyoming Game and Fish:

(b) For the taking of antelope, deer, mountain lion, or gray wolf where designated as a trophy game animal, a hunter shall use:

  (i)   Any center-fire firearm of at least .22 caliber (excluding .22 Hornet) and having a bullet weight of at least sixty (60) grains and firing a cartridge of at least two (2) inches in overall length, or any other cartridge of at least .35 caliber and at least one and one-half (1.5) inches in overall length, and using an expanding point bullet; or,

  (ii)   Any muzzle-loading rifle or any muzzle-loading handgun of at least .40 caliber and firing an expanding point bullet or lead ball and using a charge of at least fifty (50) grains of black powder or its equivalent; or,

  (iii)   Any shotgun firing "00" or larger buckshot, or a slug.

When I spoke to the Game and Fish Dept, They dropped the 500 ft. LBS clause as they thought it was to confusing to hunters and to hard for Feild Wardens to verify.

[The_Shadow]

Wyocaddis, another fellow Wyoming friend of mine were in a discussion about this a little while back.  Yes the use of many semi auto cartridges are not considered for hunting purposes. 
The 10mm Magnum would be able to make the applied specs though. 
We were also discussing the use of sabots with muzzle loaders where the traditionalist frown on them and the use of substitutes of real black powder...

The more recent bear encounters have been on the increase as well.

Welcome to the forum and be safe out there!