New Winchester 10mm Defense Ammo (not Silvertip)

[Intercooler]

Winchester must have their head in the ground 

Paltry ballistics... won't sell many!

[4949shooter]

Winchester must have their head in the ground 

Paltry ballistics... won't sell many!

I thought the same. At least the JHP is decent velocity-wise.

[Overkill338]

I would love to see Underwood sell in 50/ct boxes.

The explanation I got from Underwood was, some people want just enough ammo to fill up a magazine, and dont have $40-$50 to spend on a box of ammo. They wont ever have the 50 rd boxes again, because they'd have to double their warehouse size.

[Rojo27]

The explanation I got from Underwood was, some people want just enough ammo to fill up a magazine, and dont have $40-$50 to spend on a box of ammo. They wont ever have the 50 rd boxes again, because they'd have to double their warehouse size.

There is the exact problem Overkill....  Underwood used to sell the 50 round boxes for high $20's / low $30's...  Similar to their target ammo line now.  It all used to run in and around that range.  We aren't talking 10 years ago.  No personal offence to whomever answered the phone or e-mail at Underwood but their response to you was pretty patronizing or at least intentionally ignorant. 
Those 50 round boxes built that business (particularly in 10mm but other pistol calibers as well).   

[Overkill338]

The explanation I got from Underwood was, some people want just enough ammo to fill up a magazine, and dont have $40-$50 to spend on a box of ammo. They wont ever have the 50 rd boxes again, because they'd have to double their warehouse size.

There is the exact problem Overkill....  Underwood used to sell the 50 round boxes for high $20's / low $30's...  Similar to their target ammo line now.  It all used to run in and around that range.  We aren't talking 10 years ago.  No personal offence to whomever answered the phone or e-mail at Underwood but their response to you was pretty patronizing or at least intentionally ignorant. 
Those 50 round boxes built that business (particularly in 10mm but other pistol calibers as well).   

I'm trying to find the email, but I correspond with Justin, A LOT, so this may take awhile.

[Rojo27]

I'm trying to find the email, but I correspond with Justin, A LOT, so this may take awhile.

Oh, I'm definitely not doubting the content of your communication, didn't mean to give impression that I did.  I would however, challenge the foolish notion that consumers only want enough ammo to "fill a magazine"....  Now the $50 to $60 a box of ammo bs was correct in so much as Underwood customer base are PEOPLE who generally won't spend $1.00 per cartridge + delivery on warm to hot decent jhps....  For that they got Buffalo Bore, Double Tap, Cabellas, Speer, Federal, etc. 

Started buying from Underwood in 2011 when they were up and coming enterprise offering excellent value proposition combination of product, quality & price vs competition and remained so for years.  Therefore I purchased thousands of rounds with various projectiles and calibers over the years from them. 

I get the retail $1.00  per round economics of individual cnc machined copper bullets but not a traditional jhp. 
With the 10mm coming back in a big way to the degree that the majors Hornady, Federal, Speer and others  offering more attractive performing products the game is evolving.  The gap between a box of 20 Hornady 180gr XTP for $15 @ 1275fps and box of 20 Underwood 180gr XTP for $20 @ 1300fps isn't one that's particularly favorable to Underwood IMO. 

[5pins]

Years ago I was talking to the owner of Pro Load and asked him why be switched from 50 round boxes to 20. He said because not only was he making more per round but selling significantly more.

[Overkill338]

I'm trying to find the email, but I correspond with Justin, A LOT, so this may take awhile.

Oh, I'm definitely not doubting the content of your communication, didn't mean to give impression that I did.  I would however, challenge the foolish notion that consumers only want enough ammo to "fill a magazine"....  Now the &40 or $50 a box of ammo was correct in so much as Underwood customer base are PEOPLE who generally won't spend $1.00 per cartridge + delivery for warm to hot decent jhps....  For that they got Buffalo Bore, DoubleTap, Cabellas, Speer, Federal, etc. 

Started buying from Underwood in 2011 when they were up and coming enterprise offering excellent value proposition combination of product, quality & price vs competition for years.  Therefore I purchased thousands and thousands of rounds with various projectiles and calibers over the years. 
I get the retail $1.00  per round economics of individual cnc machined copper bullets but not a decent traditional jhp. 
With the 10mm coming back in a big way to the degree that the majors Hornady, Federal, Speer and others  offering more attractive performing products the game is evolving.  The gap between a box of 20 Hornady 180gr XTP for $15 @ 1275fps and box of 20 Underwood 180gr XTP for $20 @ 1300fps isn't one that particularly favorable to Underwood IMO.

I didnt mean to sound like I was being argumentative. I'm just looking for it so I can show their exact reply. I just summed it up. But, that's all it boils down to, he said most people just want enough to fill a magazine. Me personally, for my 29, I want enough to fill the two ten round mags, and three 15 round mags.

[Overkill338]

Rojo, I found it.

Offering both 20s and 50s would be terrible for inventory, we'd nearly have to double our warehouse racking to house everything. Maybe in the future.

The 20s and 50s debate is never ending. This decision is incredibly helpful to the mass majority of shooters, many just simply can't afford to pay or don't want to pay $40-60 for a 50 round box of ammo at a time, the $15-30 price range is more friendly to the general customer who wants to try a few different loads and eventually settle on a carry ammo that they can purchase in larger quantities when the decision is made. There's pros and cons to everything, but at least we did not boost prices when we offered the 20 count option over the 50.

[4949shooter]

They have steadily been increasing their prices. My friend and shooting buddy now refers to them as "Overwood." Over priced wood.

They are losing their original customer base of people who wanted full power loads at a reasonable price.

[Overkill338]

They have steadily been increasing their prices. My friend and shooting buddy now refers to them as "Overwood." Over priced wood.

They are losing their original customer base of people who wanted full power loads at a reasonable price.

I will pass that along.

[Pablo]

They have steadily been increasing their prices. My friend and shooting buddy now refers to them as "Overwood." Over priced wood.

They are losing their original customer base of people who wanted full power loads at a reasonable price.

This and the their inventory answer is a bit ridiculous. Inventory - OK maybe too many SKU's can be a problem, but giving your customer what he/she wants and making reasonable money is never a problem.