Range, how far is too far with a pistol?

[Ridgerunner665]

12.6 grains of AA9 was a little light under the Nosler...

Went to 12.8 grains with the CCI 350, a little bit of a squeeze to get it in there, but it works without crushing the nose of the bullet.

1,306 fps according to my new chrono (using IR lights) which was double checked against a friend's Labradar...the Labradar came up with 1,307 fps.

The 5 shots and the average are at 15 feet from the muzzle.

[Mike D]

I'm interested to see how you are getting 1300fps out of an XTP 200 grain in a handgun. With my 6-1/2" barrel on mine the best I've been able to safely achieve is about 1225.

I killed a doe last year at 30 yards with it. She ran less than 25 yards with a shot through the lungs.


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7 inch KKM barrel
12.8 grains of Accurate #9 powder
CCI 350 primer
200 grain Nosler JHP

1,306 fps

The same can be done with the XTP at 12.6 grains of Accurate #9, the XTP is a longer bullet than the Nosler, by about .010".

These loads in a stock Glock 20 generate 1,225 fps... My pistol is a Glock 40, with the longer, tighter KKM barrel.

Interesting, thanks for the info.


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[Grenadier]

Interesting discussion and it contains some good info. I will offer my comments on the OP's original hypothetical premise.

Since this is a 10mm (.40 cal) forum let's start with a look back at the .40-60 Winchester. That cartridge first appeared in the Winchester "Centennial" model of 1876. It was a black powder cartridge, medium in size between the big .44s and .45s, and the "small" .38s (just like like the 10mm). In its day it was a powerful deer cartridge and a much better choice than the popular .44-40 WCF. The .40-60 Winchester was very popular. Winchester offered loaded ammunition for 58 years. To put that into perspective, consider how many modern "wonder cartridges" we've seen recently that didn't even last half that long!

The original .40-60 Winchester factory load was a 210gr lead bullet going 1562 fps and producing 1136 ft-lbs at the muzzle. Even in its day the .40-60 was thought of as a deer, black bear, and antelope cartridge not as a big bear and moose cartridge. No doubt that's why Canada selected caliber .45-75  over .40-60 for the 1876 rifles they issued to the RCMP. The standard 1876 Winchester came with a barrel mounted rear sight but some were offered with vernier sights. With those sights, the .40-60 was probably not at all useful for hunting beyond 300 yards. Further, most .40-60 hunting was surely conducted closer than 200 yards.

We know that if you can get a bullet in the right place at just about any distance it is capable of killing. People have been killed by errant .22LR bullets fired from more than a mile away. It's just a matter of chance. But we don't want to depend on chance.

So, let's compare the .210 gr .40-60 Winchester factory load to a 220gr hard cast bullet coming out of a 10mm auto at 1200 fps with 710 ft-lbs of muzzle energy. Perhaps that will have some validity.

Chart and tables showing the comparison are here:  http://www.shooterscalculator.com/ballistic-trajectory-chart.php?t=874703dc

The first thing we notice is that the 10mm bullet drops really quickly once it gets past 100 yards. I think it might be difficult to find a rear sight high enough for shooting much past that distance.  For example, with a 50 yard zero you would need to come up 1-3/4 feet at 150 yards, 3-1/2 feet at 200 yards, and over 6 feet at 250 yards.

We can also see that the .40-60 has about the same velocity and energy at 150 yards that the 10mm has at the muzzle. If the .40-60 is best for hunting within 200 yards with 300 yards being the extreme then, based on this comparison, we can see the 10mm 220gr load is best used for hunting at 50 yards with 150 yards being an extreme distance.

Remember, though, that most of today's shooters would classify the old black powder .40-60 Win as a marginal deer cartridge. Still, I think within 50 yards the 10mm is adequate and within 50 yards is probably what most handgun hunters consider a reasonable hunting range for a 10mm auto.

[Kenk]

I like the 20 - 30 yard shots, with good shot placement, using a 180 - 200 gr load from UW, or your own hand rolled equivalent, the outcome will be to your liking...most times that is.

[gandog56]

I don't know, how good are your eyes? Is the gun Red Dot or scoped? I guess there would be a max where if the bullet actually hit something it would not have enough force to penetrate any more.

[AZ_Shooter]

I keep my 10mm under 50 yards on game, but I am only hunting with the stock open sights.  I might push it up to 75 yards for deer-sized and under animals with a red dot.

[Kenk]

Lol, with my vision / using iron sights, I always keep my deer hunting range at 30 yards or less, the G20 is a very capable weapon, however in my case, I know my limits

[WideflatnoseGC]

The 10mm cartridge with well constructed bullets is capable of taking game further than most shooters can manage. That being said, there is no substitution for practice. 100 yards is well within the cartridges capabilities. I know this by taking WV size white tails with it slightly beyond that distance with xtp bullets. They have always performed when called upon on whitetail deer. As for other larger game, I cannot add in. 125 lb whitetails 100 yards is well within the limitations and offers ethical passage of the game.

[180 Grains]

I shot this pig at 80 yards with factory Hornady 180 gr XTP. Full pass thru. The pig was +/- 200 lbs.



For reference. I'm 6'3" 245 lbs.

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[Kenk]

Nice job!

[Trapper6L]

Years back I had issues with hogs coming to the feeder pens and running the cattle off. At the time, the truck gun was a 30-30 Contender Super 14 that is highly modded for competition steel plate shooting....the old silhouette game. I was loading nuclear loads under the Remington Core Lok soft point. It's more of a game bullet than anything. Came up to the barn and here's a 400lb hog feeding on my cattle feed. As we all know, hogs can't see anything past 5 feet but they great smell and hearing. Worked my way over to the fence, got a good steady rest on a fence post and touched the Contender off. Hog was maybe 20 yds away. He hit the ground, then got up, ran thru a 1x 6 corral fence, then ran thru a chain link fence, then took off across a 500 acre coastal grass patch. Could not believe that hog ran off and looked like I never touched him. I gave it an hour and then drove across the coastal patch and he laying at the fence on the other side. Near perfect shot on the shoulder with a large exit hole. I doubt there would have been any difference if I had shot him with a 300 Win Mag. Some animals can just pack off a lot of bullet. Coyotes are the same down here, They can pack off bullets that could kill an elephant. I had a few pack off 350gr HP out of a 458 Winchester. So when talking about how far with a pistol, it makes a difference what animal you're shooting. Deer, no big deal, they're an easy kill. Hogs, coyotes, different story. On deer I've killed them at 100 yds with a scoped pistol. But it's probably not something I'd try with the crude sights that come on the average pistol. We practice shooting a 6" round steel plate at 100 meters and I'm reasonably good at it. My brother apparently doesn't know how to miss though. So distance shooting with pistols is in our game book but you need to know what you're shooting at before making any blanket statement about a pistol at distance.