Glock vs Rock Island

[ntgunter3]

This is my first post so I'm sorry if this has been asked before, I checked back a few pages. I'm debating between getting a rock island armory ultra fs hc (52009) and a glock 20. I like the RIA because of the true safety and because it holds an extra bullet. However it's also much heavier and I'd be carrying this backpacking mostly and I could just get the +5 extension for the G20. I'm wondering if anyone has experience with one or both of these guns preferably. My two main questions are can the RIA shoot 40 S&W and how much difference does that half an inch increase in barre length make on bullet velocity and overall force?

[sqlbullet]

I have a Glock 20 Gen 3 SF and a Para Ordnance P16-40 converted to 10mm.  The Para is about identical tot he RIA Ultra FS HC.  They even use the same mags.



My experience is I have a non-ammo related stoppage about every 4-5 magazines in the 1911.  The stoppages are always a three-point jam and a light bump to the slide gets it going again.  This goes up a great deal if the magazine spring is weak.  I have polished the extractor and ensured it has no burrs or sharp edges.  I have also polished the breech face.  Before I got the gun the barrel was aggressively throated, to the point that after conversion to 10mm it is more prone to a brass bulge than my Glock.  It is also finicky about COAL.  The three point jams grow to 2-3 per magazine with most bullet profiles of the COAL is over 1.250".

As you mention, it is also a good bit heavier than the Glock.  This becomes noticeable on all day carry.  A plus for the 1911 is when carrying IWB, the thinner 1911 slide is more comfortable inside the waist band.  But, it drags your pants down more.  And, yes I use a good CCW belt, a Desantis Econobelt.

The Glock just runs.  The only malfunctions I have seen in my Glock have been in the hands of new/inexperienced shooters that are limp-wristing their grip.  I do not recall a single malfunction and I have fired close to 2,000 rounds through the Glock.

You will lose about 26 fps and about 26 lbs-ft of energy from the .4" shorter barrel. This is based on data from http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/10mm.html.  I compared the 5" and 4" velocities for the 180 grain Buffalo Bore, 175 Grain Silvertips and the 200 grain XTP loads.  Methodology to obtain velocity was to 5" velocity - ((5" velocity - 4" velocity)*.4).  Energy was calculated by (velocity^2*weight in grains)/450432.

About shooting 40 S&W.  Up to you.  Lots of guys here do so.  I personally do not because I handload and don't hardly every shoot factory ammo anyway.  If I were going to I would consider a $99 lone wolf conversion barrel for my Glock VERY cheap insurance against the possible ill effects.  A lone wolf barrel will be a true drop in conversion.  Event "drop-in" 1911 barrels usually require some fitting.

If you expect to shoot a lot of 40S&W, I would definitely suggest the Glock.  It will handle it better than the 1911, be cheaper to repair if something goes awry, and it is trivial to install a 40 S&W barrel to ensure you are completely safe. 

[ntgunter3]

I have a Glock 20 Gen 3 SF and a Para Ordnance P16-40 converted to 10mm.  The Para is about identical tot he RIA Ultra FS HC.  They even use the same mags.



My experience is I have a non-ammo related stoppage about every 4-5 magazines in the 1911.  The stoppages are always a three-point jam and a light bump to the slide gets it going again.  This goes up a great deal if the magazine spring is weak.  I have polished the extractor and ensured it has no burrs or sharp edges.  I have also polished the breech face.  Before I got the gun the barrel was aggressively throated, to the point that after conversion to 10mm it is more prone to a brass bulge than my Glock.  It is also finicky about COAL.  The three point jams grow to 2-3 per magazine with most bullet profiles of the COAL is over 1.250".

As you mention, it is also a good bit heavier than the Glock.  This becomes noticeable on all day carry.  A plus for the 1911 is when carrying IWB, the thinner 1911 slide is more comfortable inside the waist band.  But, it drags your pants down more.  And, yes I use a good CCW belt, a Desantis Econobelt.

The Glock just runs.  The only malfunctions I have seen in my Glock have been in the hands of new/inexperienced shooters that are limp-wristing their grip.  I do not recall a single malfunction and I have fired close to 2,000 rounds through the Glock.

You will lose about 26 fps and about 26 lbs-ft of energy from the .4" shorter barrel. This is based on data from http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/10mm.html.  I compared the 5" and 4" velocities for the 180 grain Buffalo Bore, 175 Grain Silvertips and the 200 grain XTP loads.  Methodology to obtain velocity was to 5" velocity - ((5" velocity - 4" velocity)*.4).  Energy was calculated by (velocity^2*weight in grains)/450432.

About shooting 40 S&W.  Up to you.  Lots of guys here do so.  I personally do not because I handload and don't hardly every shoot factory ammo anyway.  If I were going to I would consider a $99 lone wolf conversion barrel for my Glock VERY cheap insurance against the possible ill effects.  A lone wolf barrel will be a true drop in conversion.  Event "drop-in" 1911 barrels usually require some fitting.

If you expect to shoot a lot of 40S&W, I would definitely suggest the Glock.  It will handle it better than the 1911, be cheaper to repair if something goes awry, and it is trivial to install a 40 S&W barrel to ensure you are completely safe.

think I'm going to go with the Gen4 G20. If I put an aftermarket barrel in it do you think it would still shoot 40s just fine? I don't plan to do it regularly but I like the ability.

[Buff7mm]

If you put an aftermarket 40 S&W barrel in it it should run just like a purpose built 40 S&W, I actually run a Lone wolf 357 Sig barrel and a 10mm in my G20 gen3, a Jarvis .45ACP in my G21 gen3, a storm lake 10mm in the G29 gen3, and a Lone wolf 9mm in my G17 gen4. I find Lone Wolf barrels to be very accurate and I've parked all my factory barrels and replaced them with aftermarket barrels since I handload and like shooting cast bullets.

[Keiichi]

Buff7mm, I think ntgunter3 is referring to the uncommon practice of firing .40 S&W from G20s with their stock barrel, and is asking if a LW 10mm barrel can still do that.

ntgunter3, you might send an email to Jeremy S.  He may be able to advise you on that...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwXtEm70Q0M

However, firing the wrong caliber is never advisable, even it it has been done "safely" by someone else in their gun...

[Patriot]

Why not a Witness if you want a gun with a safety?

The P-Carry is a great lightweight gun, holds 14+1 rounds, has a safety. Cheaper than both of the options you listed as well. I own two and they both have been flawless.

[Buff7mm]

Buff7mm, I think ntgunter3 is referring to the uncommon practice of firing .40 S&W from G20s with their stock barrel, and is asking if a LW 10mm barrel can still do that.

ntgunter3, you might send an email to Jeremy S.  He may be able to advise you on that...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwXtEm70Q0M

However, firing the wrong caliber is never advisable, even it it has been done "safely" by someone else in their gun...

Roger that.
But why would a person risk screwing up a good gun for the just over $100 it would cost for the 40 barrel, I never could understand some peoples thinking when it comes to things like that.