Received my TNW Aero Survival carbine today...

[jeffreybehr]

I shot it with maybe a half-dozen reloads and some PPU factory 180s and it functioned perfectly except for several top-cartridge-in-the mag instances when it failed to feed the cartridge into the chamber.  If I cleared that 1st cartridge, the next 1st cartridge failed to feed.  If with the bolt locked open I single-fed a cartridge into the chamber, closed the bolt, and inserted the mag, it worked perfectly every time.  Today I loaded a few dummies to 1.26" OAL, and they fed perfectly, but the 'regular' reloads, too, did.  So...maybe tomorrow I'll get the 1.26"ers out to see how they do.

Anyone else have this problem?

[jeffreybehr]

Seems my carbine, using Glock20.4 15rd. mags, prefers longer rather than shorter cartridges.  I load my pistol's rounds to 1.25", but 1.26" and even 1.27" eliminates most--but not all--of the failures to feed.  I'm about to call TNW to see what they say about it.

FWIW, it functions perfectly other than this.

[jeffreybehr]

Seems my carbine, using Glock20.4 15rd. mags, prefers longer rather than shorter cartridges.  I load my pistol's rounds to 1.25", but 1.26" and even 1.27" eliminates most--but not all--of the failures to feed.  I'm about to call TNW to see what they say about it.

...

Update: TNW's 'Scott', who is not the ASR tech. wizard, told me two things--one is that the 10mm barrel's feed ramp was slightly redesigned just a few weeks ago and that I may have the initial version of barrel; and that he believes the follower in the Glock20 mags has been changed slightly so that the nose of the cartridge sits slightly too high at the bullet...BUT...he's not sure of this, so I shouldn't start modifying my mags.  The tech. will call me tomorrow.

[jeffreybehr]

Chris, the technician, asked a bunch of questions and finally offered to send a new barrel as soon as he could find one, including a return label for my barrel.  I infer from the offer of a new barrel that it may well have been redesigned recently; Chris said nothing about Glock 20.4 mag followers.

I plan to shoot my carbine at longer ranges tomorrow at Ben Avery; we'll see how it does, at functioning and grouping.

[jeffreybehr]

...and EVERY top cartridge in any mag failed to feed; good thing TNW is sending a new barrel.

I decided to sight it in again carefully using the final practice load I've chosen** and started with dead-on at 10 yards...which turned out to be a mistake.  I know and knew there's a substantial difference--about 2.4 inches--between the bore line and the sight line, and I knew the trajectory would be rising, but I didn't anticipate it'd be as much as it is, to the point where the 50-yard POI was about a foot high and generally off my target.  I'll restart the process tomorrow with POI about 2" low at 10 yards and see where we go from there. 

Other than the constant top-cartridge-nonfeeding problem, the carbine shot very nicely and relatively softly even from the bench; I guess that LimbSaver slip-on recoil pad* did its job very well.


* and the maybe-half-inch-thick pad of terrytowel I took with me so that I didn't damage my arthritic right shoulder.
** the Winchester 180 at about 1125FPS

[jeffreybehr]

jeffrey, after you get it sighted in for 50 yards, if wouldn't mind, would you post your group size and what your recipe (or ammo) is?

Certainly, and I had some good results for a while today until my 'scope started coming apart, so it turned into time to go home.

One interesting result was getting a 180g. Winchester bullet going 1419FPS-MV with 11.2g. of N105 with an extreme spread of only 10FPS from a small sample of 4 shots.  (VV's max. charge is 9.9g. for c. 1250FPS from a 5.5" barrel.)  All resulting primer pockets were still tight, so I might squeeze another tenth or two into the cases.  I think the only reason I can get this much of N105 into these cases is because I'm seating the bullets to an OAL of 1.27".

[jeffreybehr]

jeffrey, after you get it sighted in for 50 yards, if wouldn't mind, would you post your group size and what your recipe (or ammo) is?

Certainly, and I had some good results for a while today until my 'scope started coming apart, so it turned into time to go home.

One interesting result was getting a 180g. Winchester bullet going 1419FPS-MV with 11.2g. of N105 with an extreme spread of only 10FPS from a small sample of 4 shots.  (VV's max. charge is 9.9g. for c. 1250FPS from a 5.5" barrel.)  All resulting primer pockets were still tight, so I might squeeze another tenth or two into the cases.  I think the only reason I can get this much of N105 into these cases is because I'm seating the bullets to an OAL of 1.27".

And I'm STILL working on this.   

One thing I've determined--mine, if no others, seems NOT to be a 100-yard longarm.  Today shot some good groups, but at 100 yards, the 'group' appears more like a 4-aught-shotshell pattern...at 100 yards.  The 50-yard 10-shot group measured almost 5", and the resulting 100-yard attempt was so low only 4 shots were on the target paper.  For other reasons, I decided a few days ago to use only 'better' bullets for all my 10mm practice loads and ordered 3000 XTP180s while Midway had them on sale, so I guess I'm starting over.  But I'm smarter now...I think.   

Bullets arrive tomorrow, and I'll be at Ben Avery Saturday.  Today's official high temp was only 101dF and it was noticeably not as hot.  102dF is forecast for Saturday. 

Oh yea...got the Win180s to 1461FPS-MV today over 11.4g. of N105, only 1.5g. over VV's max. of 9.9, and the resulting primer pockets are still tight.  That's plenty fast for me!

[jeffreybehr]

OK, finally.  Started today with the new, somewhat-faster practice loads using the XTP180s--specifically StarLine nickeled cases, WLPs, 6.0-6.3* of Universal, XTP180 seated to about 1.254-1.258.  Average muzzle velocity is 1216FPS, ES34, sample size 5.  After starting at 15 yards and then centering the groups at 25 yards, the 50-yards groups averaged about 4" for 5 shots.  My earlier practice load using the Win180 and 5.8-6.1g. of Universal with a MV of 1160FPS shot 5", 5-shot groups at 50 yards.  All of these were shot using an inexpensive plastic rest and a pistol scope set usually on 4X.

Other than I'm still waiting for the new 10mm barrel (coming because this one won't feed any first round of a magazine with an open bolt), I'm finished frustrating myself trying to adjust the sights/scope of this carbine.

Hmm...maybe I'll restart the high-velocity loads with N105.   


* These are the extremes of what my measure dispenses; the majority of the charges are 6.1 or 6.2g.  2016Aug28 note:  I've since changed to a different Lee powder measure; it's good for plus-or-minus 0.1g., and I'm now loading the XTP180s with 6.5±0.1g. of Universal for cc. 1280FPS-MV.

[jeffreybehr]

My buddy and I had a great couple hours blowing up waterjugs, etc., this afternoon at 'Bumblebee Mine'.  The carbine (and my S&W M&P 45C) performed flawlessly but for the former's inability to feed the first cartridge in the mag, which I now habitually obviate by filling the chamber manually and closing the bolt before seating a mag.  TNW apparently will be sending the new 10mm barrel soon, as they sent me a return label this afternoon.

I have felt for a week or three that this carbine is not as noisy as my 4.6"-barrel pistol, and having someone else shoot it confirmed that.  I think it's time to again increase the velocity of my carbine-practice rounds, maybe to around 1275 for the next batch of 100.

Shot an XTP180 thru two layers of denim:

Looks just like an expanded XTP, which is plenty fine.   

The one thru the 6-layer pad escaped due to my poor shooting.   

[jeffreybehr]

Hurray!!!!!!!!!  Received the new 10mm barrel today and tried--but didn't shoot them--several different combinations of cartridges, # of carts. in the mags, dummy cartridges v. real ones, etc..  ALL fed perfectly.  I'll be at Ben Avery Saturday with a heavy bag of lots of different ammo to test. 

Poor me--I must go shooting tomorrow!

Oh yes--received a new Bushnell Trophy Handgun 2-6X scope too, and mounted that.

[The_Shadow]

Good luck, hope the new barrel solves that issue...

[jeffreybehr]

...at least about 99% of it.  Shot a half-dozen different loads today.  ALL of them fed successfully from the mags starting with an open bolt.  Had only two failures to feed, one with the Federal Vital Shok Trophy Bonded; can't remember the other.  I'm happy.

Of four 'careful' 50yd., 5-shot groups, the smallest was 3-1/4" with the average a bit over 4".

I measured velocities of three cartridges shot with both my Witness polymer 4.6"-barrel pistol and the 16-1/4"-barrel carbine.
Federal Vital Shok Trophy Bonded 180*--carbine 1664FPS-MV v. pistol 1290, increase 374FPS.
SIG-Sauer V-Crown 180--1454 v. 1212, increase 242FPS.  NOTE--this data corrected.
PPU (Prvi) JHP180, 1171 v. 1097, increase 74FPS.

The new Bushnell Trophy 2-6X 32mm Handgun scope worked mostly very well with excellent optics (especially after I focused it), but its 20" of eye relief is too much--I can't get far enough away from it even with the scope mounted as far forward as possible.  I have a Vortex Optics 2-7X 32mm Scout Rifle Scope with 10" of eye relief coming.

2016Aug28 note--I'm increasingly convinced that this ASc is a 50-yard (and not a 100-yard) shoulderarm, which is fine with me--it's still quite enjoyable to shoot.


* This load hurt my right hand a bit with the pistol; it's really stout.  Those wanting maximum velocity with a very tough 180g. bullet (and having lots of money for ammo) should LOVE this one.

[jeffreybehr]

...

jeffreybehr: "2016Aug28 note--I'm increasingly convinced that this ASc is a 50-yard (and not a 100-yard) shoulderarm, ...

I was afraid of this, as this is what I have experienced so far.

And this causes me to wonder if it's any more (or less) accurate in 45Auto.  But probably I'll notify TNW that the new barrel still doesn't feed cartridges with an open bolt, and I expect to return the carbine to them for fixing.

[sqlbullet]

I have a feeling that screwing the buffer tube in farther will only result in the spring being fully compacted before all the recoil energy is absorbed and will cause excess pressure on the end of the buffer tube. Any ideas on the negative results this may/ will have on the buffer tube?

None.

That buffer tube is from AR-15/AR-10 stock.  In those guns the buffer definitely hits the end, and it handles cartridges like 308 Winchester, and even the short magnums just fine.  I abuse one with 358 Winchester.

10mm is a love tap comparitively.