What we are fighting

[sqlbullet]

http://chicago.suntimes.com/news/steinberg-would-be-terrorists-can-buy-guns-but-a-reporter-no/

This article is a great one to sends to you pro-gun control friends.  Ask them to read it carefully.

Then point out to them the following errors.

40% of guns sales omit a background check.  Can I get a source on that cause I am calling BS.  I live in Utah, where until just a few years ago there was a huge gun classifieds section in the paper and even here that isn't close to true.

"[He owns 100 guns because he] is afraid".  Really.  No.  If you are afraid you buy one gun and learn to use it.  If you have 100, you just like guns.

And the real winner "The real reason...is guns stores make their money in the dark".

Sorry, Mr. Steinberger, the real reason is the law.  Specifically the Domestic Violence Offender Gun Ban amendment to the Omnibus Consolidated Appropriations Act of 1997.  Apparently you were charged with beating your wife.  And the good upstanding gun owners of the united states, specifically those that own and run Maxon Arms, decided they felt it was more important to protect society from you than to make a buck.

Here is what I find most interesting about Mr. Steinberg's closing statement.  We tend to interpret others action within the context of our own motivations.  What does that reality say about Mr. Steinberg?  Seems like it says he is fine with breaking the law if you make a little dough in the process.

How very Chicago of him.

[Wolfie]

What is a conservative in America today?

I am pro Family Values, pro Police/Military and pro Fiscal Discipline. I used to sit in my office listening to "conservative talk radio" for years between calls. What was accomplished? The Conservatives are now backing a guy for president. Who is 100% pro Gay, dodged the draft and went bankrupt 4 times.

Is that conservatism?

Its BS, and today conservatism is code for being a racist and or being rich.

[Wolfie]

Everyone needs to follow the Constitution.

[sqlbullet]

A political conservative is in favor of the least possible change and is reticent to try a new approach to an issue.  A liberal desires frequent and often radical change.

I am in favor of a government which respects that it derives its powers from the consent of the governed with strong protections for minority rights. Our constitution was a mid 18th century attempt to to document this philosophy in a foundation document of a governmental experiment.

Due to the nature of the founding document departing liberally from the status quo governments of the day, our country is fundamentally liberal.  We embarked on a radical new form of government.

Today, I find myself somewhat conservative.  I feel the founding documents did a pretty good job of codifying the philosophy.  But I also find that our government has deviated pretty far from the document.  Today over breakfast this came up with a co-worker.  I expounded to him my belief that the government gets it power from the people, a group of persons.  The people is the collecting power of a person.  Therefore if a person is not endowed with the right to own a gun of a specific type, then by inheritance the people aren't nor is the government.  Similarly, if I cannot of myself rightly prohibit my neighbor from an item, then I cannot delegate to the society that power.

[Geeman]

  I expounded to him my belief that the government gets it power from the people, a group of persons.  The people is the collecting power of a person.  Therefore if a person is not endowed with the right to own a gun of a specific type, then by inheritance the people aren't nor is the government.

Not in the legal definition.

Grab a blacks law dictionary and look up "natural person" which is you as an animal.  Its the thing God created.  It is alive and in possession of all the rights the creator gave to him/her.

Now look up the term "legal person".  It was created by man.  It is an artificial thing created by Government to strip the rights God gave and substitute  privileges which may be taken back.  Its a dead thing.  A corporation.  A piece of paper.  A fiction.  When you hear the word "person" it is the "legal person" that they are referring to.

The creator of something owns or controls that which he/she made.  God created and controls the man, the natural person.

Government created the person, and rules over that created fiction.

The difference between the "natural person" aka "man" vs. "legal person" aka "person" is at the root of if you are dealing in "common law" or suffering the effects of the statutes/codes of what in reality is "Roman Civil Law".  One form of law gives power to the people, the other gives power to the governments.

Nasty word games they play against you.

Greg

[sqlbullet]

Yeah...I am not ignorant of those definitions.  Which is why I said to him, and always say "person".  If the individual on the other end of the dialog wants to we can then start to have this debate, after which I can show them how they are become a reasonable man and not a natural person.

And I prefer to keep God out of it.  He is notably either quiet on these issues, or tells different people different things.

[sstewart]

Don't believe what people say about God. Read the book. (Bible) not s twisted version. There are many balanced ones translated from early manuscripts.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[yfdcap]

What is a conservative in America today?

I am pro Family Values, pro Police/Military and pro Fiscal Discipline. I used to sit in my office listening to "conservative talk radio" for years between calls. What was accomplished? The Conservatives are now backing a guy for president. Who is 100% pro Gay, dodged the draft and went bankrupt 4 times.

Is that conservatism?

Its BS, and today conservatism is code for being a racist and or being rich.

So what is the alternative?  Clinton?

[Wolfie]

Clinton balanced the budget and lost ZERO troopers in combat missions he initiated.

I feel bad that I never voted for him, that was a period of my life that I believed the GOP was pro family values, balanced budgets and strong foreign policy.

Now Trump is more pro gay than Hillary, just said he will let Muslims in and his economic plan adds 20 trillion to the debt.

So is Hillary better, absolutely.

btw: He just hit Obama for deporting too many illegals, carry on.

[yfdcap]

I disagree. 

[Charlie_Zulu]

So is Hillary better, absolutely.

One question... or two actually...

Better for SCOTUS?

Better for gun rights??

Sorry, I'm a one-issue voter this time around and SCOTUS is 1st and foremost.  Trump's already thrown his candidates out there.  I cringe at the thought of the other's choices.

[Geeman]

What we are fighting.....?

* Powers that divide us.  Rich against poor, young vs old, pro-this vs anti that...

* Government servants that refuse that governments were created to benefit man.

* Federal banks that are really private for-profit institutions creating money beyond the control of government.

* Controlled media that is no longer the watch dog needed for a free society.(thank goodness for the internet/bloggers, but they seek control of that too.)

* Public education that trains students to be asleep at the controls.  How many senators/congress members?  What is a Republic?  What is the Bill of Rights?  What is the Constitution and what was it made for?  Forget about mathematics.  Forget about trade skills.  Global warming is all that's important because that's what brings in more education dollars so we can increase administrative wages in the district.  Believe what your told and don't question authority.

Americans are asleep.  That is the biggest thing.  Until that changes, nothing else slows the destruction and the deterioration of the American ideal.

Greg





I'm not of either party, nor will I ever be.  I'm closest to Libertarian. 

[Wolfie]

Trump last week said he was for gun control.

Yesterday he complained that Obama was deporting too many illegals.

Go ahead and bet on Trump, I am sure the rich like that.

[larryh1108]

I'm sitting here, watching the news.
What do I see?
Hillary marching in a gay parade.
Wait!
Can't be!
Wolfie said that Trump likes gays more!
Our Hillary in a gay parade?
Tell me it ain't so!
Hmmmm, I didn't see Trump there.
He must have been at a local KKK meeting, huh?
Wolfie, you twist your facts more than the media does.
Give it a rest.
You aren't wowing anybody with your insight and savvy.

Be careful what you ask for, you just may get it.
If your candidate gets elected, forums like this will become forums talking about how nice the good old days (today) were.
I'm surprised you even belong to a gun forum.
You seem intent on converting others (us) to see things your way. Good luck.
Go to a Feinstein or Bloomburg site if you want like-minded people to chat with.

[yfdcap]

I do not believe anything I see or read in the news.  First hand experience here.  They will say what ever they want.  They do not have to have facts or even be telling the truth.  Twisting words and taking one sentence out of txt and running with it.