45 ACP being stopped by heavy clothing?

[Buckeye 50]

A friend of mind said a policeman friend of his claims that his dept. showed in controlled testing that some heavy clothing configurations (multiple heavy winter coats, etc) actually prevented some 45 acp round from penetrating into ballistic gelatin.  This some like another "long" fictitious rumor started by someone wanting their name in lights to me.

My question is has anyone heard RELIABLY of any such thing?

Thanks,

Pat 

[Geeman]

Here's a .32 being stopped by a vest.

http://www.break.com/video/genius-tests-bulletproof-vest-with-friend-2423834

Please don't try this at home.  That goose egg says it all!!!!   

Greg

[Pinsnscrews]

To steal a phrase from Mythbusters "Plausible"

There are some caveats though

It was during the FBI testing, and it had to do with a specific weight and velocity Hollowpoint bullet. The details of which I can not remember. The particular bullet failed repeatedly to penetrate the Winter Clothing testing. There were a number of calibers that had the problem.

[10mmfan]

I heard from a local leo that they left the .45 for the .40 for that reason, the 9mm also failed. It was something to do with dickies and north pole jackets I believe.

[Buckeye 50]

My guess is the 10mm would NOT be in that category!

[10mmfan]

In the leo's case he said he switched his personal carry from a 9mm to a 357 sig, he asked what I carried and I told him a 10mm he said he'd never heard of it we talked about it for a while and he said he would look into it. I also talked to a retired deputy who said he was issued a s&w 10mm in the 80's and the recoil was terrible.

[Aegis]

Who was making 10mm in the 80's.. 

[4949shooter]

In the leo's case he said he switched his personal carry from a 9mm to a 357 sig, he asked what I carried and I told him a 10mm he said he'd never heard of it we talked about it for a while and he said he would look into it. I also talked to a retired deputy who said he was issued a s&w 10mm in the 80's and the recoil was terrible.

Terrible recoil to some shooters might not be terrible to us.

[Raggedyman]

Sound to me like someone misunderstanding the fact that heavy clothing can prevent expansion with certain bullet designs, especially at low velocity.

[Pinsnscrews]

Raggedyman, the bullet failed to penetrate the clothing. I do recall it was a lightweight round, just not the weight specifically.

[Rojo27]

Never heard this one, so not able to weigh in on specific bullet design or weight question in the original post

However as to the here and now: I wouldn't have slightest pause about 45 acp 230 grain modern HST, Gold Dot, Ranger, PDX 1, etc. in personal defense scenario and range regardless of BG clothing (excluding bullet resisting material of course).   If it'll run through 4 layers of heavy denim and still hit 12 to 18 inches of penetration in calibrated ballistic gel I wouldn't worry too much about heavy coat(s).

[4949shooter]

I have read on a few occasions that the M1 carbine round had failed to penetrate the Chicom's padded winter coats during the Korean War / Conflict. These US soldiers I believe were firing at distance though, and were supposedly not at typical handgun ranges.

[sqlbullet]

Who was making 10mm in the 80's..

Ammo or guns?

Ammo:  Norma, and by the end of the decade Federal and I think Winchester.

Guns:  Bren Ten, Delta Elite and S&W 10XX guns.

That is just off the top of my head.

[Raggedyman]

I have read on a few occasions that the M1 carbine round had failed to penetrate the Chicom's padded winter coats during the Korean War / Conflict. These US soldiers I believe were firing at distance though, and were supposedly not at typical handgun ranges.

I believe that this is a bunch of crap, too. Not the story, we've all heard it; I believe that a .30 carbine bullet has all the energy it needs to get through very thick clothing at 500m or more. Stories like these are probably the result of either the soldier not hitting the target or the enemy not falling like they do in the movies.

I don't believe for a second that any center fire load capable of cycling the action would be stopped by clothing. I'm not going to buy it no matter what the rationalization unless someone can show me a test where it happened.

[my_old_glock]

I have read on a few occasions that the M1 carbine round had failed to penetrate the Chicom's padded winter coats during the Korean War / Conflict. These US soldiers I believe were firing at distance though, and were supposedly not at typical handgun ranges.

I believe that this is a bunch of crap, too. Not the story, we've all heard it; I believe that a .30 carbine bullet has all the energy it needs to get through very thick clothing at 500m or more. Stories like these are probably the result of either the soldier not hitting the target or the enemy not falling like they do in the movies.

I don't believe for a second that any center fire load capable of cycling the action would be stopped by clothing. I'm not going to buy it no matter what the rationalization unless someone can show me a test where it happened.

I agree

It is usually just an excuse that some people used because they couldn't hit their target. It is the same thing that is being claimed of the M16/M4 in Iraq and Afghanistan.




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