IMR 800-X now changed to Hodgdon 800-X?

[REDLINE]

I see Graf & Sons is showing 800-X from Hodgdon.  First time I've seen 800-X with the Hodgdon name in place of IMR.

Anyone know if it's, for all practical purposes, the same powder as what was always in the IMR labeled containers?  Improved in any way?  Anyone actually tried it yet in direct comparison to what's always been in the IMR labeled bottles?



http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/product/productId/28003

[nickE10mm]

Wow.  I'd love to know the deal on this ....

Also, maybe Hodgdon reformulated or has new "official" data for this powder.  Who knows.

A call to Hodgdon would probably be best.

[The_Shadow]

That's interesting!   Seeing how Hodgdon has all of it (Hodgdon, IMR and Winchester) under one company I would expect it to be the same!  I sent an e-mail to Hodgdon for further clarifications...I'll report what they say!

If someone else hears something please advise. 

[The_Shadow]

It is the same product just rebranded to the Hodgdon label.

Dave Campbell
Customer Service Representative
Hodgdon Powder Company
6430 Vista Drive
Shawnee, KS 66218
913-362-9455 Ext. 117
dcampbell@hodgdon.com

[EdMc]

So they are doing away with the IMR labeling? Winchester next? Any difference in pricing with the new labeling?

[REDLINE]

Thanks TheShadow!

EdMc -  click on the link below the pic for price.  I believe they had IMR at the same price.

[attrapereves]

So they are doing away with the IMR labeling? Winchester next? Any difference in pricing with the new labeling?

Since IMR, Hodgdon, and Winchster are all the same company, I don't see a reason for them to keep all three around. It would be much easier and less confusing if everything was under one brand.

[The_Shadow]

There are several IMR powders which are scheduled to be dropped by 2015

IMR will drop IMR 7625, IMR 4759, IMR PB and IMR 4756

[BEEMER!]

It is my understanding that Hodgdon has never manufactured any of their powders, but marketed powders made to their specs by other producers.

Bruce Hodgdon got his start by selling surplus powders and moved that into a growing business.

That is why we had 296 and H110, 231 and HP38, and several other powders that were nearly identical to each other but withe different names as they were manufactured by the same company.

[EdMc]

Thanks TheShadow!

EdMc -  click on the link below the pic for price.  I believe they had IMR at the same price.

Actually, they don't show IMR 800X listed with IMR powders. Not that that means anything one way or the other. Who knows, more corporate games..........

[REDLINE]

I wonder what, if anything, IMR got out of the deal?  I also wonder if it won't be a fairly short amount of time before IMR bails from the smokeless powder game all together.  I mean;  If IMR only currently exists as a small handful of rifle powders, what's the point anymore?  Or maybe that's enough to keep them happy?  Or maybe anyone who ever was IMR has bailed long ago, and it's down to Hodgdon simply toying with the IMR  name?

Like EdMc said;  "...corporate games..."

I imagine we'll never know the answers.

As for Winchester, do they actually produce anything anymore?  Are they down to being only a name on a package?

On the bright side, maybe all our current IMR labeled 800-X containers will become collectors items?

[The_Shadow]

Well here are some facts;

St. Marks Powder, a General Dynamics Ordnance and Tactical Systems company, is a leading manufacturer of commercial smokeless powder.

Address: 7121 Coastal Hwy, Crawfordville, FL 32327
Phone:(850) 925-6111
http://www.gd-ots.com/commercial_powder.html

Most Commercial smokeless powders are produced by St. Marks Powder, Hodgdon is a distributor and may contract with special blends of their own.

In March 2006, Hodgdon® Powder Company and Winchester Ammunition announced that Winchester branded reloading powders would be licensed to Hodgdon.

Started by E.I. DuPont, black powder plant in Delaware. the IMR powders used to be labled as DuPont products, then IMR ("Improved Military Rifle") http://www.imrpowder.com/history.html

Hodgdon Powder Company purchased IMR® Powder Company in October 2003.

Alliant under the ATK industries (Alliant Techsystems), http://www.atk.com/

Alliant's origins as a gunpowder manufacturer can be traced back more than 125 years to the DuPont Company, whose leadership position in the explosives industry is legendary. DuPont's divestiture in 1912 created the Hercules Powder Company as an independent entity, and eventually resulted in Alliant becoming America's premier gunpowder manufacturer.

The long, proud history of Alliant Powder began in 1872 as Laflin & Rand, later to become Hercules Powder Company — the most respected name in the reloading industry.

http://www.alliantpowder.com/general/about_us.aspx

Western Powders is distributor for Ram Shot, Accurate Arms, Norma https://www.westernpowders.com/

I hope this helps provide some insight, for those who seek to understand the history of Smokeless powder for sporting arms and handloaders.

[EdMc]

Well done Wade. I had an uncle that worked and retired from Hercules at the Brunswick, GA plant many years back. Not sure what it is today, certainly doesn't make gunpowder if it even still exists. Corps buy up companies and use their names and products as it suits their needs. I suppose Hogdon finds it beneficial at this time to cease using the prior company names on their products.

S&W, Remington, Winchester and many others are no longer independent companies, just a part of one corporation or another. 'Tradition' is only a marketing phrase. Like it or not, this is our modern world.

[Quick 2]

Hodgdon now owns the IMR Company. There are very few companies left that is not a part of a larger subsidiary just like RCBS, Blackhawk and a few others are one conglomerate. Remington owns Marlin, Bushmaster and I think New England Firearms and another that I can not think of. When you go onto Hodgdons website for reloading data you see loading data for Winchester,IMR and Hodgdon. S&W own Thomson Centerfire and others. In the world we live in today it makes since to verge companies to keep them afloat. Marlin would not be around anymore if Remington had not bought them. Winchester is made way more by other companies than Winchester themselves. I think they are still making a few bolt action gun but as far as anything else someone else does it.