Underwood case blowout over on 1911Forums

[The_Shadow]

We actually need a chambered cartridge picture to show the 6 o'cock support as a first step.  Support vs. the amount of casing blow out.

Given the impulse of the ammo, did the next round in the magazine experience a bullet setback (hit by previous round during ejection or barrel ramp)  That could raise the pressure to a higher level.

1911 styled guns do function a little differently with respect to lockup and recoil spring rates...

Are we seeing a change or weaker web in the Starline Brass?

[REDLINE]

Are we seeing a change or weaker web in the Starline Brass?

I doubt it.

[Bro KV]

Response from OP

Alright, I have a bunch of pictures and info from Kevin (who called me today).

First the pictures for every one to see and then I will address the call.

So I field stripped the Hunter (which has ~1,000 rounds through it) as well as a few of my other 10mm pistols and took side by side photos of the barrels.



1) The WC Hunter with ~1000 round count
2) WC TE also ~1,000 round count
3) NHC Heine long slide ~5-600 round count
4) Stock Glock 20 barrel ~2-300 round count
5) KKM Glock 20 barrel 5-600 round count





These two show the barrels with the Underwood 180 grain TMJ rounds in the chambers and the ramp area.





The above two pictures show the barrels with WC rounds in the chambers.

[Bro KV]

Continued

The next set of pictures show just the 1911 barrels and the Underwood ammo in an upright chamber as well as the "blown out" round in the Hunter's chamber.











That was a tight fit to place the blown out round in the chamber since there was expansion of the case.

[Bro KV]

Continued

So to address the phone call from Kevin today.

He was very professional as well as concerned for both his customer as well as his product.

I described the events that happened and he immediately asked if there was damage done to the pistol and that he would reimburse me for any repair/work that was needed.

We narrowed the loads down to a patch that I had purchased last July.  Since I store my range ammo in 50 cal ammo cans I can't send him the boxed ammo.

He wants me to ship him the ammo in question and he will replace/reimburse me for it.

He did state that at the end of last year they had decreased the pressures in the 180 grain loads (as well as other loads) while trying to keep velocity up.  That was more reassuring that the ammo I have bought this year has less pressure and less risk of this occurring again.

He wanted to test some of the ammo in question, so as to learn something from it.

He said that are constantly checking and rechecking their loads and pressures so that they are putting out the best ammo possible.

All in all it was a great interaction.  Kevin is a stand up guy and runs an equally stand up company, especially since their ammo prices have not changed since all the panic buying.

[The_Shadow]

In this picture, it looks like the cartridge is not fully head space inside?  Maybe backed out some...

[Intercooler]

   That first picture doesn't it look like the barrel in question when viewed there has the least of all 5 in support at the ramp area?

      At any rate I don't see anything too extreme there. Anyone want me take pictures of any of mine in the same setting let me know.

      Pretty much what Kevin told me today too. Don't know but... I couldn't do ammo 

[Intercooler]

Took some pictures of the DW barrel in similar positions with an Underwood 180 TMJ

[Intercooler]

In this picture, it looks like the cartridge is not fully head space inside?

I looked that one over and agree. More of the brass in the 8 to 4 area is exposed than the new round inserted in.

[Intercooler]

Bro,

      Can you ask what MFG and spring rating he is running?

[4949shooter]

  If you feel strongly about it Kevin's Facebook page would be a good place to relay the message.

    It actually is changing for a few. Me personally I am fine with it as it is and wouldn't try to change Kevin's product or suggest it. If I don't like it move to say DoubleTap. Maybe the wrong way to put it but that would be like buying a Corvette and telling them to change the engine or put a limiter on it because it's too radical. Phone him up and express your concerns about a change because he will give you an ear. It's tough in the high performance arena it seems.

I am not on Facebook, but even if I were I wouldn't put anything on Kevin's Facebook about this because I wouldn't want to trash his business.

I have no inclination to express my concerns to him either. There is other ammo I can buy in 10mm which is plenty powerful enough. Hopefully he can straighten this out. I am a proponent of 10mm and I don't want to see any ammo manufacturer take a dive. Kevin knows the concerns, and now it is up to him to fix them.

I will have to disagree with your Corvette analogy though. "Norma" level (SAAMI) ammunition IS FULL POWER 10mm. We  are not giving up anything by loading ammo to the level the guns were designed to handle.

[4949shooter]

Oh, and as Redline said earlier, quality control may be an issue as well.

And I still like Pacapcop's suggestion of a 170 grain load at 1300 fps.

[Intercooler]

   What was the original Norma. Even that is confusing because I read initially it was a 170gr@1400 FPS then they backed it down to 1300 FPS when it was scaled back. The current 180's are at 1300 FPS which isn't far off.

[Bro KV]

Bro,

      Can you ask what MFG and spring rating he is running?

Done and waiting for a reply

[4949shooter]

   What was the original Norma. Even that is confusing because I read initially it was a 170gr@1400 FPS then they backed it down to 1300 FPS when it was scaled back. The current 180's are at 1300 FPS which isn't far off.

From my understanding it is 170 @1300 to 1350.

And 200 @1200.