Corona Virus, Left wingers, and guns.

[Muskrat]

No need to apologize Graybeard, it's not really a nerve. I just think that defining people as "left" or "right" is simplistic and divisional and ultimately counterproductive to everyone. It's an easy trap to fall into, but I've yet to see a trap that was worth the cheese.

I think a lot of people who are now interested in guns were never anti-gun, just gun-neutral. They never saw a need for one, never really wanted one, never gave it much thought. That politicians they may have supported were not "pro-gun", for lack of a better definition, wasn't even a part of their decision matrix. It just wasn't on their radar.

Some will crucify them for that, but the philosophy that If You're Not With Us You're Against Us is among the lowest forms of bullying...right down there with name-calling and stereotyping. In my experience, bullying is the refuge of people who cannot support their viewpoint any other way.

If someone who was previously uninterested in firearms now has some interest, then great. Maybe a little too little and a little too late on their end, but probably not. Probably there will be plenty of guns and ammo and ranges available in a few months, and those people might go from being gun-neutral to gun-interested or even gun-positive.

Just my opinion, of course.

[Keiichi]

Another good video today from Hickok45 that can be a resource for new gun owners.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Efw9Dy0r08

[Graybeard]

No need to apologize Graybeard, it's not really a nerve. I just think that defining people as "left" or "right" is simplistic and divisional and ultimately counterproductive to everyone. It's an easy trap to fall into, but I've yet to see a trap that was worth the cheese.

I think a lot of people who are now interested in guns were never anti-gun, just gun-neutral. They never saw a need for one, never really wanted one, never gave it much thought. That politicians they may have supported were not "pro-gun", for lack of a better definition, wasn't even a part of their decision matrix. It just wasn't on their radar.

Some will crucify them for that, but the philosophy that If You're Not With Us You're Against Us is among the lowest forms of bullying...right down there with name-calling and stereotyping. In my experience, bullying is the refuge of people who cannot support their viewpoint any other way.

If someone who was previously uninterested in firearms now has some interest, then great. Maybe a little too little and a little too late on their end, but probably not. Probably there will be plenty of guns and ammo and ranges available in a few months, and those people might go from being gun-neutral to gun-interested or even gun-positive.

Just my opinion, of course.

Sadly, defining most people as left or right is the reality we live in. For my entire life there has been that division and it has been drawn over the same two issues, gun rights and abortion rights. It's an unfortunate political manipulation that often forces people to vote against their own interests in other areas over those two things. Gun rights people have few, if any, options on the left since John Dingell died and abortion rights people have the same from the right.

I'm not suggesting a "If You're Not With Us You're Against Us" mentality. I've spent much of my adult life introducing new people to shooting sports and continue to do so. Make friends not enemies has always been my plan. I think we're both on the same thought process, perhaps just bogged down by terms.

[buck]

I find the difference betweem the 2 parties is more then 2 issues.  I know people that think the Republican party is all about big business.  And others that vote mostly about ecology and savings the planet. I vote to the right mostly about 2A rights. But disagree over many other things the party stands for. If I want to know what a democrat or a rebublican think or believe. I don't ask there oposition.  It is about like asking a man to explain how women really think and feel. It is out of my realm.

[Graybeard]

I should have said the two most consistently recurring issues. Yes, there are always more differences, but those two never seem to go away. Others seem to drop by the wayside. They've been a constant in every election since I can remember because of the way they motivate people.

I also think it's the parties that drive these divides. Many of you may not know of (D)John Dingell. He as about as left as one can be when it came to social programs, union support, etc. But he never voted for gun control, ever. Lots of UAW workers in his district, many hunters/shooters, and Dingell was himself. He was always going to win his seat in the House, so he couldn't be forced by the party to go after gun rights.

After his death, his wife ran for his seat. She won and immediately reversed course on gun rights. She was a weaker candidate and needed party support. I think the leadership of both parties have made it clear which side of the two previously mentioned issues candidates haveto be on to get into office.

Just my 2 cents.

[sqlbullet]

About the only thing I agree with the Republican platform about is 2A.  But it is also the most important issue to me at vote time.

[buck]

I think the farthest left and farthest right are the ones that get the presses air time. And people ending up believing that is what the parties are all about. Which can end up causing divides which the moderates have to contend with. The progessives  and the tea party are not the majority but they get the presses attention.  And people believe that is what the party is all about.

[cphills]

and the above is why all here should reload....

I have been digging out all the brass I have laying around and will be spending a fair bit of the weekend running my version of a "one arm bandit".

I have never thought of my press as a "One arm bandit". Dang funny.
Now, I will chuckle each and every time.

[Muskrat]

I wonder how much the pandemic death tole is going to increase due to tens of thousands of people rushing out to buy their VERY FIRST GUN, with no oversight, training, or mentoring. In my law enforcement career I saw many more accidental shootings than self-defense shootings. Suicides vastly outnumbered both combined.

[Graybeard]

I've had those same thoughts. Unfortunately, those potential issues will outlast the pandemic. Once this is over, I think the experienced firearms owners of the world need to need to offer up some assistance to these folks. At the very least it saves on the bad press and it may save someone's life.

Muskrat, as someone who has seen some horrible deaths up close, I'm sorry that you had to respond to those situations as part of your job. I know it takes a toll on one. Thanks for what you do, or did.

[38-40]

So I was in an ag store that sell sporting good and firearms yesterday and heard one of the sales guys talking to an other person about not wanting to sell to some of the people he said the only good news is he was out of ammo so they bought the gun but have me ammo[emoji16]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Muskrat]

I've had those same thoughts. Unfortunately, those potential issues will outlast the pandemic. Once this is over, I think the experienced firearms owners of the world need to need to offer up some assistance to these folks. At the very least it saves on the bad press and it may save someone's life.

Muskrat, as someone who has seen some horrible deaths up close, I'm sorry that you had to respond to those situations as part of your job. I know it takes a toll on one. Thanks for what you do, or did.

Thanks for the kind words Graybeard...cops don't get thanked a whole lot. I'm lucky... I went into law enforcement in my mid thirties, after I'd pretty much already formed my impression of the world and the people in it. I felt real sorry for recruits who got into it in their early twenties, before they had seen enough to form an impression of the world outside the law enforcement lens. If the world you see in law enforcement is real world to you, it's very hard to be a balanced, positive, rational person. Lots of younger recruits quit in less than a year, and I always thought "good for you" when they hung it up.

Last week I taught a sixty-year-old man to shoot. He'd never even held a gun before. He still can't hit a garbage can at 20 yards with any regularity, but he knows to keep his finger off the trigger until on target, and he knows where the muzzle is pointing at all times. He might very well never hold a gun again, which is fine. But if he does, it won't go off accidentally and hit something important. I feel good about that.

[Graybeard]

You're welcome Muskrat. I've had two LEOs in the family. One did the high school/army/LEO route and the other became an LEO later in life. I know, exactly, the difference you're referring to. Unfortunately, the former had the "us and them" mentality for quite awhile. He fought a lot, only had other cops as friends, etc. The latter had the type of personality that just won most people over without becoming a confrontation.

FWIW, I've been teaching a female friend and neighbor to shoot for a little over a year. She's 61, never owned or shot a gun before. Her husband has, but has no interest. She now has a concealed pistol license, owns her own gun and is looking to buy a .22 in the same platform.  At 25', she's actually pretty good. Just started teaching an acquaintance, 62 yr old male, to shoot handguns, before the pandemic hit. He's got quite a bit of rifle experience. Sadly, someone introduced him to handguns with a snubbie .357 and a .44 mag. Which leads me to the next point.

I am often told by people that wish to learn to shoot handguns that on their one prior experience they were given thoroughly unpleasant guns to shoot. Too many women were handed ultralight .38 snubbies with +P loads and told "this will be perfect for you." Make it fun for new shooters, regardless of age. Get the fundamentals down with something that doesn't build in a flinch with the first mag/cylinder. Seems like it should be an obvious course of action to me, but I've heard of too many experiences where that wasn't the case.

[Kenk]

For sure, whenever I take out a first time shooter, I introduce them to the .22, if the enjoyed it, I give them an opportunity with a 9

Ken