Touche'

Of course that is why we must establish a nominal power level that the guns are made to. The 1006 and the Glock are built like tanks. I added an inch to my 10's slide not so much to gain velocity as to gain mass to slow slide velocity.

DAB

Macc283, Of course you are right. The 10 mm came first. I was just describing the cartridge in a manner to convert .40 S&W shooters. Moreover, the greater case capacity leads to lower chamber pressure on equivalent loads.

DAB

Historically, the .357 started out with a 158 gr pellet moving at 1500 ft/s in the 1930's. My old Speer #11 manual gives 46,000 CUP. More or less psi with engineering factors that smear out the definition. It says 1349 ft/s over 13.0 grains of Blue Dot.

Speer gives 43,500 for the .41 Magnum and also 43,500 for the .44 Magnum. The SAAMI loading seem to decline over time unless met with resistance.

The original Norma loads for the 10mm were 1400 ft/s for a 170 grain and 1200 ft/s for a 200 grain projectile. I fear, specifically, that certain guns - coughwitnesscough - may cause the ammunition to be downgraded to the point where we might as well be using the short and week. I would love to know the old Norma pressure loads to give a nominal figure for the .40 Automatic Magnum.

Ying Ko, You show the original full power loading as Nuclear in Red. Are you indicating that such are too powerful or beyond the pale?  Such is the downgrading I fear. I also have been sneered at and told 'Never bring a gun that doesn't statr with a four." This was said by a man with a .40 S&W!

My Caspian 6 inch longslide is made for the full power loads.

   The 10mm has a branding problem.

   It's a great cartidge, but it hasn't caught the mass of the people's attention. The name "10mm" made sense in the mid 80's when the 9mm was growing in popularity, but now it doesn't mean anything to most people.

   I suggest we rename it .40 Automatic Magnum. That is what it is. It is a .40 automatic lengthened just a touch and loaded to much higher pressures. The rename will make the cartridge's potential intuitively obvious.  The phrase "Always use a cartidge starting with a 4." leaves people uncertain about the 10. If lazy people call it the auto mag, I'm OK with that.

   The other problem is that there doesn't seem to be a pressure standard tied to it. We refer to the original Norma loads that put a 170 grain pellet out at 1400 fps or a 200 at 1200. The Silvertip used to be quoted at 165gr at 1265.  We need a maximum pressure standard to define a useful magnum load to differentiate it from the .40 S&W. I propose 40,000 psi. A touch more than a .357 Mag but less than a .44 Mag or .41 mag.  This would protect us from manufacturers reducing the power of the 10 to a .40 S&W and making full powerful ammunition unavailable and a legal liability. Any other pressure nominations?

DAB



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   The 10mm has a branding problem.

   It's a great cartidge, but it hasn't caught the mass of the people's attention. The name "10mm" made sense in the mid 80's when the 9mm was growing in popularity, but now it doesn't mean anything to most people.

   I suggest we rename it .40 Automatic Magnum. That is what it is. It is a .40 automatic lengthened just a touch and loaded to much higher pressures. The rename will make the cartridge's potential intuitively obvious.  The phrase "Always use a cartidge starting with a 4." leaves people uncertain about the 10. If lazy people call it the auto mag, I'm OK with that.

   The other problem is that there doesn't seem to be a pressure standard tied to it. We refer to the original Norma loads that put a 170 grain pellet out at 1400 fps or a 200 at 1200. The Silvertip used to be quoted at 165gr at 1265.  We need a maximum pressure standard to define a useful magum load to differentiate it from the .40 S&W. I propose 40,000 psi. A touch more than a .357 Mag but less than a .44 Mag or .41 mag.  This would protect us from manufacturers reducing the power of the 10 to a .40 S&W and making full powerful ammunition unavailable and a legal liability. Any other pressure nominations?

DAB