Quote from: The_Shadow on June 08 2018 08:16:48 PM MDT
My Bar-Sto barrel is a Match Grade 40S&W chambered for the S&W 1006, and I drive them to near 10mm velocity...175 grain cast @ 1100 fps from that 5" tube.
No leading and clean using White Label Lube's Carnauba Red.  I used to use Rooster Lab's Red Zambini, but they went away and after years of use no issues but have run out so I switched to Carnauba Red which was rated to 2700+ fps in rifles for clean bores.

I have used this lube with the 9x25 Dillon at 1800 fps no issues.

Thanks! I may get some cast sized at .400 & some sized at .401 and see which work better. I am hoping that .401 works great as I can get some 180gr coated bullets from Missouri at that size with no lube grooves. I have had great results with their 240gr cast in my Henry & revolvers. If their .401 sized bullets won't work in my Bar-Sto, they will work at least decently in my Lone Wolf .40 S&W conversion barrel.

Quote from: The_Shadow on June 08 2018 08:13:44 AM MDT
I use them through all of the S&W 10xx factory barrels, Bar-Sto barrel for my S&W and also my Glock Factory and Storm Lake and Lone Wolf barrels.  The Bar-Sto and Storm Lake have tighter chambers...


Cast bullets can be Sized larger in some firearms, I size my 44 mag at 0.4315", For my 9mm, 357Sig and 9x25 I use 0.3550" - 0.3560" jacketed and cast bullets at 0.3565" to 0.3570" in several barrels with no issues

Thanks, yes I size my 44 cast at .432 since the groove diameter in my Henry is .431. Normally 0.001 over groove diameter works well. How did the cast sized at .4015 work in your Bar-Sto barrel? Do you ever have any leading in the Bar-Sto or is it really clean?

Quote from: The_Shadow on June 07 2018 09:49:49 PM MDT
I size my own cast bullets at 0.4015" for the 10mm,they provide a great seal and become accurate in most bores and feed reliably in all of my 10mm pistols.

What barrels are you using for those?

Yeah, I was kind of hoping he would say .401 is best. Harder to find cast bullets, particularly coated that are sized at .400. I will probably order some 165gr TCFP from Penn Bullets. They will size them for me at .400 and hard to beat their price at $79 per 1000. I had good results with their 200gr RNFP .44 bullets that they sized for me at .432.

Haven't been here in a while, but started back a couple of weeks ago handloading some 10mm and .40 S&W with some great results using Sport Pistol and an X-treme  180gr RNFP HPCB bullets in both the .40 & 10mm. But when I tried Power Pistol and the same bullets I had terrible bullet instability out of my stock Glock barrel. I ordered a Bar-Sto semi-fit barrel today that was in stock and already in the mail. I spoke with Irv Stone about what size cast, whether plated will work well, what OAL, whether to use an undersize sizing die, and a number of other questions. He is extremely helpful, intelligent, and forthright. I am extremely impressed with him and his staff. He informed me to use only heavy plated 12 to 15 thousands in plating thickness, and cast bullets should be sized at .400. His barrels are spec'd at .400 to .4005, but he says don't go over by .001 as is common in most barrels because of the greater depth of the rifling in his barrels.


I am going to try some cast sized at .400. Have any of you that have Bar-Sto barrels chambered in 10mm used cast and what size did you use?

Yes, it would seem that Speer would use a flash suppressed propellant with any of their Gold Dot loads. 7.6gr of BE-86 would be a max load for a 190gr JHP per Alliant's online load data.

I just looked back at DRSJR1969's data sheet and video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEPtBFA3pk4. That was posted on Apr 3, 2012. He saw the same velocities out of his Glock 20 that I saw with mine with the stock RSA but a little greater velocity spread.

1-1141
2-1133
3-1117
4-1108
5-1142

AV-1128 ES-34

Yes, I have the link to your pulldown of those saved. I'll send you those shortly when I can get out of the house. I don't see how this lot is loaded with 8.4gr of Longshot. My hand load with 8.0gr of Power Pistol and an X-Treme 180gr HPCB bullet matched the velocity. However, I had a horrible ES & SD. I think my scale is very erratic and I will be buying another.

Your 8.2 gr charge looks to have a good ES & SD. Do you find that one to be the most accurate?

Intercooler,

I would be happy to. It will be a few days before I am out of the house. But, that would be good to see the difference from the ones he pulled down before. And, yes these are the 1200fps version.

The_Shadow,

Weren't the cases Starline? The ones I have use Starline. C.O.A.L. is just a tiny bit longer at 1.242. Every one that I have measured was at that length. Everything else seems to be the same.

Yes, I am crimping in a separate step as well. A medium crimp resulted in very poor accuracy. Lighter better, but not good.

I am wondering if part of the issue I am seeing may have to do with my Lee scale. Seems to be finicky and perhaps the powder charges are varying too much.

Are you using X-Treme's heavy plated or standard plated bullets?

I just started hand loading for 10mm. I have been hand loading for straight walled revolver cartridges for decades, but none for semi-auto's.

I loaded up some 10mm with Red Dot & Power Pistol using once fired Starline brass. This brass was from Georgia Arms 180gr Gold Dot or their 180gr plated load. I used WLP primers. I used a Lee carbide four die set and weighed each powder charge. OAL varied from 1.245 to 1.249" for the Red Dot load & from 1.247 to 1.251" for the Power Pistol load on the ones I measured. I used a light crimp about a fifth to quarter turn after touching the case mouth with a Lee FCD.

I chronographed them using a Competition Electronics ProChrono Digital from 10 feet. Temperature was 71 degrees, 85% humidity, 29.9 inHg, elevation 33 feet. Firearm used was a Gen 3 Glock 20 with stock barrel & RSA.

First string was 5.0 gr of Red Dot, X-Treme Bullets 180gr Heavy Plate Concave Base bullet. X-Treme says these are .400", but I measured them at .401.

1-911        6-925
2-933        7-952
3-947        8-951
4-932        9-945
5-929       10-929

Hi-952 Lo-911 Ave-935 ES-41 SD-13

This load was intended to duplicate a soft shooting 40 S&W load and it almost exactly duplicated a 40 S&W load from Freedom Munitions with a 180gr plated bullet (same X-Treme bullet or their lighter plated bullet with flat base). I chronographed the Freedom load the same day:

Hi-968 Lo-913 Ave-943 ES-55 SD-15

Next is 8.0 gr of Power Pistol and the same bullet:

1-1088       6-1124
2-1130       7-1098
3-1128       8-1129
4-1156       9-1118
5-1103      10-1162

Hi-1162 Lo-1088 Ave-1123 ES-74 SD-23

With this load I am trying to duplicate my carry load which is Georgia Arms 180gr Gold Dot which I also chronographed the same day. Velocity wise I did that almost perfectly on the first try. I did not expect to do that with this load as I figured the Georgia Arms load would be faster than I saw and I would need a heavier charge of Power Pistol to match it.

What I did not like with this load is that large ES & SD. It might have been slightly tighter with the Wolf Gunsprings guide rod & 20lb spring and velocity would probably be higher. But, it would not have improved it enough to be satisfactory. Accuracy was mediocre with this load.

Previously, I had tried various charges of Power Pistol (6.8, 7.2, 7.6, 8.0, & 8.4gr) with the same bullet, OAL, primer, once fired case, but with a medium crimp and accuracy was horrible particularly with the 8 & 8.4gr charges. With this load I tried to duplicate the crimp of the Georgia Arms load by crimping just enough to elimate the bell of the case mouth. Accuracy improved, but it is not anywhere close to the accuracy I get from the Georgia Arms load, 2 3/4" five shot group from a mediocre rest at 40 yards as an example. More than double that with this load at least.

The Red Dot load seems to be sufficiently accurate, similar to the 40 S&W remanufactured loads ffom Freedom. But I would like those to be a bit better if I can get there.

Any suggestions on where to go from here to get better accuracy? Should I stay with the same crimp? I did not notice any bullet set back from chambered loads that I examined, but I did not bring my calipers. Next time I will bring them and measure a few. Should I try 8.4 & 8.7gr of Power Pistol and see if the ES & SD decrease?

This past weekend, my wife and I chronographed the Georgia Arms 10mm 180gr Speer Bonded Hollow Point (Gold Dot) load http://www.georgia-arms.com/new-10mm-180gr-speer-bonded-unicore-hollow-point-p/. This has been my carry load in both of my Gen 3 Glock 20's.

Chronograph was a Competition Electronics ProChrono Digital. Measurements taken from 10ft. Temperature 71 degrees with 85% humidity when we started and 74 degrees with 78% humidity when we finished, pressure was 29.9 inHg, 33' or thereabouts elevation. Firearm used was a Gen 3 Glock 20 with stock barrel.

First string was with the stock RSA:

1-1136             6-1116
2-1138             7-1112
3-1124             8-1137
4-1131             9-1116
5-1126            10-1130

Hi-1138 Lo-1112 Ave-1126 ES-26 SD-9

Second string was with a Wolff Gunsprings steel guide rod & 20lb spring:

1-1148          6-1140
2-1146          7-1148
3-1134          8-1147
4-1150          9-1141
5-1159         10-1140

Hi-1159 Lo-1134 Ave-1145 ES-25 SD-6

Third string was with the Wolff Gunsprings steel guide rod & 24lb spring:

1-1134           6-1134
2-1137           7-1153
3-1145           8-1150
4-1135           9-1144
5-1138          10-1153

Hi-1153 Lo-1134 Ave-1142 ES-19 SD-7

We didn't nearly see the advertised velocity of 1200fps, nor the 1220fps that Intercooler saw. However, it is a very consistent and accurate load. At the end of our session I did a 5 shot group of 2 3/4" off of a mediocre rest at 40 yards. That is the only group I shot that day with that load, but seems typical of this load.

I found that my main carry magazine for this particular 20 was not functioning well at all with this load. I was seeing failures to feed every few rounds. The nose of the bullet was either lodging against the chamber on the left side or nose diving into the feed ramp. It performed the worst with the 24lb spring. However, I have found previously that it doesn't always like the 24lb spring no matter the magazine with 180gr loads that are over 1100fps. The 24lb spring works fine with very lite 10mm loads and 40 S&W loads. The 20lb spring worked the best with this magazine, but still had some issues. Good thing is that with these malfunctions with a 20, they are extremely easy to clear. Simply pulling back slightly on the slide and either easing it forward or letting it slam will allow the bullet to feed. I have replaced the springs of three of my magazines, including this one, with +10% extra power springs from Wolff Gunsprings. I'll give these a test next time I am at the range.

I don't think the lower velocity I saw was due to inaccuracies with my chronograph as I also tested a Speer Gold Dot 9mm load and saw slightly higher velocities than their advertised. Other chrono tests of that same load I have seen, showed velocities right near the advertised.

I am liking the Wolf Gunsprings guide rod with the 20lb spring and now leaving it in this 20 for carry purposes. I have a couple of other weight springs I may try, a 22, 19, & a 17lb. I may have to buy a second guide rod and several sets of springs for my other 20.

Yes, keeping them at moderate velocities will help make sure that they do not come apart. Plated shotgun projectiles do really well thru hard barriers like safety glass, much better than the non-plated soft lead versions. And, soft lead slugs also hold together much better when they are launched at a slower velocity.

cool, thanks