just out of curiosity, do the factory loads have the case mouth covering up the canelure?  when I load them to 1.250 (I know that is too long now), the canelure is not covered at all.  I guess that is why DT is putting the canelure where it is......

Quote from: The_Shadow on September 05 2014 04:45:11 PM MDT
I have measured the Double Tap WNFP Hard Cast stuff and he has reduced the COAL to 1.4200" to allow the wide Nose to tip up and into the chambers...

I am assuming you meant 1.240"...... 

Quote from: The_Shadow on September 03 2014 07:12:51 PM MDT
At those measurements they are quite small and would explain the leading.   

I have shot about 100 through my KKM barrel and 50 through my OEM barrel and have not noticed any significant amounts of leading.......I have had a hard time getting them to feed, but they have been extremely accurate and no key holing whatsoever in either barrel.  YMMV.

Radiotom - can you measure what the COAL is on those factory loads?  Trying to dial in my reloads with those bullets and as you know at 1.250" they don't feed 50% of the time.

Quote from: The_Shadow on September 02 2014 02:45:34 PM MDT
Double Tap actually had to shorten the COAL to 1.2420" to get that wide Flat Nose to feed more reliably.  The tipping angle with the wide nose makes it too long at the normal COAL...

That is good to know.  I was given some load data from Double Tap's production manager.  They were blue dot and 800-x recipes.  He advised me to use 1.250" as the COAL with CCI 300's.  Interesting that they seat their factory loads significantly deeper.......they also appear to use Longshot in their factory loads.  I actually like Longshot better because I don't have to hand weight each charge like I do with 800-X.  I can get longshot to meter almost spot on 100% of the time.  I give myself 2/10ths of a grain "fudge factor" and I feel comfortable metering longshot pretty close to book max.  I check every 5th round when I am working close to book max.  haven't lost any digits yet
I know this is a discussion for a different thread, but I wonder what the pressure increase would be going from 1.250 to 1.2420?  I had no signs of pressure with 9.3 grains of 800-X, CCI 300's, and my once fired Armscor brass.  Primers were in perfect condition, no bulges on the brass fired through the KKM barrel and only very very slight bulging with the stock barrel.  I would not even consider them a "smile".  Love the KKM barrel by the way I may load up my last 50 WFNGC at 1.2420 and back off the powder a tad and see how they feed.

I have 50 WFNGC's left.  I am going to try to replicate their factory load and seat the bullet a little deeper as well.  Based on some of shadow's pulldowns it looks like DoubleTap's factory load is a little shorter than 1.250.  When you put the bullets side by side with a 180 grain gold dot or a 200 grain XTP you can see how little taper the WFNGC's have.  Casual observation would lead me to believe they would be more difficult to feed, and my recent experience backed that up.

The funny thing is that my Gen 4 feed that particular load better than the gen 3.....but that is not saying much.  The Gen 4 hated everything.  My Gen 3 only hates that particular load.

I may search through the reloading section and see if anyone has experience with the 200 grain WFNGC's and has had good luck with them.

Quote from: radiotom on August 31 2014 10:38:03 AM MDT
Species, have you been able to shoot your new Gen 3 with hot loads yet?

Got the new Gen 3 G20 out yesterday and it seems to be working great.  I shot 50 rounds of 180 gr GDHP's loaded 9.3 grains of Longshot.  Not super max load, but getting up there.  It fed those 100%.  the Gen 4 would not take that exact load.  This was with my 22 pound spring and KKM Barrel.

I also shot 50 rounds of 180 grain Precision Delta JHP loaded to 1050 fps just to test out a load for my wife to shoot.  I put the 24 pound Wolff spring in and it was 100%.  I was pleased it fired the "weak" loads with the strongest spring you can purchase from Wolff.  The brass still ejected 5-10 feet and I had no issues with short stroking.

The day was not without issues.......   I had loaded up some 200 grain Double Tap WFNGC to near max load using 800-X.  I loaded them to 1.250" COAL.  These rounds caused FTF's about 50% of the time.  It did this with both the stock barrel and the KKM.  I also tried the stock spring, a 22 pound spring, and 24 pound spring.  All had similar 50% FTF ratios.   I am pretty sure it was the bullet and not the gun, spring, or barrel.  I have always been concerned about how big the meplat is on the doubletap WFNGC bullets.  There is not alot of taper on the bullet and I am sure that is what is causing the issues.  I may have to find another hard cast bullet with more taper.  I think Buffalo bore uses a hard cast with more taper and may feed better.  I think the Double tap bullets are actually made by Beartooth and sold by doubletap under their label.

I shot about 150 rounds and it was 100% with the loads it likes.  It hates the WFNGC.  I am pleased with the results thus far.  I will load up a few other recipes and get them a little closer to max now that I have a comfort level with the gun.  I didn't want to go out and go full tilt max load on my first day out with the new gun.  I will keep you posted, but I think the Gen 3 is a winner.

Quote from: radiotom on August 31 2014 10:38:03 AM MDT
Species, have you been able to shoot your new Gen 3 with hot loads yet?

Not yet...  :'(  Life has been a little chaotic lately. Hoping to get out tomorrow for a quick trip to the range.

I got the green front. I would get the green again in a heartbeat. They are extremely visible in all light conditions and they are a good contrast with targets and backgrounds. I love them.

I got the tritium night sights which jacked the price up a bit. They are not cheap, but well worth it.

Quote from: RMM on June 19 2013 07:59:43 AM MDT
As many of you may have noticed I like to tinker a lot, I also like to save money!  Let me introduce the "ghetto" bulge buster. 

You can even use it without removing the powder measure! (thanks to the nicely shaped "catch can")
You can also use the 10mm shell holder.

What you need:
1.  Lee FCD
2.  Spent 9mm case
3.  Empty water bottle
4.  Electric tape
5.  About five minutes

Instructions:
1.  Cut bottom off of water bottle
2.  ***Optional*** line water bottle mouth with one layer of electric tape (provides snug fit on FCD)
2.  Grind/file 9mm case down to approximately *.*" (works better than using a full-length case)
4.  Remove crimping "guts" from FCD
5.  Adjust for proper leverage (closest to the top of stroke provides best leverage)
6.  Enjoy!   ***DO NOT USE ON "SMILED" BRASS***  (You may end up looking like this  )

What is the length you cut the 9mm casing to use as your pusher?  Going to craft a ghetto setup this weekend. Thanks for the tip!

I hate to say it, but I really didn't need the brass.  I just bought it because I don't know when I will be able to purchase it again.  I guess you can call that hording 

I thought I had missed my opportunity, but I called Starline just now and they had 500 available for me to order  .  Wanted 1,000 but I was not going to complain.  The lady who took my order was extremely nice.  I am pumped I didn't miss out.  She told me Starline sold 285,000 10mm cases in a 24 hour period 

Thanks for the heads up!  I would have missed out with out the notice.

Quote from: The_Shadow on August 22 2014 10:20:52 AM MDT
Species, Glad that Glock made you "the customer", happy with the exchange and hopefully the Gen 3 will run right for you.
I really want to see Glock find the problem with the Gen4's, because many like the feel and use of the new back straps.
The Gen4's also had many new first time buyers interested in the 10mm in particular. 

I really really really liked the Gen 4 for the back straps and the new stippling on the frame.  I do miss those features.    

The dual recoil spring was a waste as I ended up swapping it out almost immediately for a heavier setup.

Quote from: chucky2 on August 22 2014 09:08:49 AM MDT
Congrats Species!  Question:  Does your Gen3 have the extended mag release that the Gen4's have?

The mag release is not ambidextrous (obviously) and it is different in look and feel than the Gen 4.  Not sure if it is considered "extended" or not.  I can post some pics.  It is quite prominent and easy to locate on the frame.

Just to update everyone on this situation.  I finally got my new G20 Gen 3 a couple weeks ago from Glock.  They shipped it to my FFL with a few extra magazines which was a bonus.  It took Glock about 2 weeks to get the replacement out the door.  Not too bad all things considered.   Overall I have to say I am pleased with Glock and how they took care of me.  Not so pleased with the performance of my Gen 4, but Glock stood behind their product and made things right by sending me a Gen 3.  Will I buy another Glock.....probably not.  Am I happy with Glock and their customer service....yes I am.

The Glock armorer who was handling my case called me when they were shipping the pistol out to tell me he personally fired 100-150 rounds of the hottest stuff he could find and the replacement ran perfectly.  I appreciated that phone call.  He said 25 of the rounds he fired were Underwood 165 grains - that was all they had on hand.  The pistol was pretty dirty when I took it out of the box.  Not bad dirty, just looked like it had been to a good range session.  That made me feel better that Glock took the time to test it out with what little hot ammo they had on hand before sending it out the door.  There was not a scratch on the gun, just dirty.

I have not been out to shoot it with any hot loads yet.  I have only had the chance to shoot some Armscor range ammo and it worked great.  I burned through all my good stuff testing the Gen 4 with various springs, mags, followers, loads, COAL's, etc and haven't had the chance to load up anything exciting.  I hope to find some time this weekend to load up a few hundred rounds and get out and test it and see how she runs.  I feel a lot more comfortable with the Gen 3 and don't doubt it will perform flawlessly.