I like the 10mm enough I'm thinking of trading one of my other handguns in on a second 10mm. I have always liked to have 2 ways to fire any ammo I have around so I end up with 2 of everything. I recently got a Glock 20 as my first 10mm. I'm in the process of getting it set up to shoot heavy bullets to carry while hunting in bear country.
For a second one I'm leaning toward a single action only I can carry on safety with the hammer cocked for a similar purpose. I've always liked 1911's very much and am considering going that route. That said any 10mm I buy will likely get carried hunting and fishing in some nasty conditions. I fish a river that is all mud and sandbars from a jon boat with a surface drive motor. Everything I take on that river gets muddy and/or sandblasted by the time I get home, sometimes before I get home. I've moose hunted Alaska in a swamp that was awful on everything too, and plan to go to similar areas in the future. A 1911 is not nearly as easy to field strip as the Sig 226 I have. I'd hate to have a 1911 send something flying while I was reassembling it in adverse conditions 100 miles from town. The Sig does not have the grip safety which is one less place for stuff to get inside and screw something up, but is also one less safety carrying a gun cocked and locked.
I already have the Glock to use for the nasty stuff, but a second 10mm will get used much the same way. If I think there is a chance I might end up hunting with the 10mm I'd definitely take the single action over the Glock. Really anytime weight isn't a huge issue I'll take the single action over the Glock. I grew up on revolvers with worked over triggers, shoot 2lb triggers on my rifles, I love good triggers.
I'll probably shoot some mid level (1200-1250fps) 180gr ammo around home, and 200 or 220gr Underwood hardcast ammo when in bear country. I want something that can handle both without a lot of switching parts. I will never use anything lighter than the Fiocchi 180gr ammo which shows 1250fps on the box more than likely.
Whatever I choose will need to have night sights and a rail. I like to have a TLR-1 light on my handgun on the river at night, plus hiking to a spot or packing meat out after dark when hunting.
What would you choose and why?
Thanks to everyone for their help.
I'd look at the Sig Tacops 1911 or the new Dan Wesson Kodiak 6 inch 1911.Both have rails but I'd go with the 6 inch.More velocity,longer sight radius and heavier
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The sig tacops would likely be my choice if i go 1911. I have several sigs that have all been great. Not finicky accurate, and reliable. It was the one i was looking at on gunbroker
If you can get by without the rail and you want to save a few dollars, the RIA Ultra FS HC is an awesome weapon. Granted, it's a tank, however my RIA has proven itself totally reliable; and then there's that 17rd factor
Ken
Ditch the Glock; get Springfield XDM 10mm. Fully supported chamber for bear loads.
I would go with the P220 Elite SAO.
This is a really good shooting pistol. The barrel is fully supported for the spicy 10mm.
The disassembly is the same as your P226.
If you decide on the 1911,
I would pick the Ruger SR1911 in 10mm. This is also a good shooter with a fully supported barrel.
I have had no problem out of either of these pistols, Good Luck.
I have the G20 and the Sig Tac ops. My sig has been 100% reliable with all ammo. I have shot all UM hard cast offered and DT 200gr HC. It is slim and packs real nice in my chest holster while out in the back country here in Montana. There is a price difference in the 220 and Tac ops to consider as well.
Thanks to everyone who has replied so far. I truly do appreciate everyone's input. When all the choices are good ones, it makes picking the right fit for me a bit tougher.
Right now I'm leaning toward the 220 SAO. Not the hunter Kryptek camo one, but the Elite. It doesn't feel quite as good as a 1911 but is similar in price and has the features I want. Still feels pretty darn good to me also.
If I was hunting in the areas of Colorado and Wyoming I've hunted muleys and elk in in the past I'd go 1911 without even thinking about it. The air is generally fairly dry even if you do get snow. It's sure possible to fall down, the ground can turn to grease with a small rain, but it's less likely. Snow with dry air is not a big factor on gun performance with a little care once you get home.
My thinking right or wrong, is based on this. My 10mm will be in river bottoms and swamps where it will get way dirtier than I'd like. I took my Ruger SR1911 and my Sig 226 both down to a field stripped level and re-assembled them 3x today at my computer desk thinking this decision over. Once I screwed up swiveling the barrel bushing into place on my 1911 and spent 10 minutes getting the pieces that launched re-located. I'll admit that the area behind my computer desk where the bushing ended up is a mess that needs entered with caution, but it still demonstrated an issue that can happen with a 1911 that a 220 won't have.
Anyone think there is a safety issue carrying a 220 cocked and locked? I have no experience with that platform, but lots with a 1911 and 226 DA/SA.
Thanks once again for your help.
I think this all really boils down to personal preference and your familiarity with different platforms. I live in Alaska and sometimes I carry a 44 magnum revolver, other times its one of my 10mms. I have an STI Perfect 10, Glock G40 and Dan Wesson Bruin. I have rendered a super redhawk completely inoperable on a brown bear hunt by stuffing it inside a zippered duffel and tossing the duffel to the side to make room for the tent. Shipped it back to Ruger they said it was beyond repair.
1911s (and Beretta 92s) have seen some downright nasty conditions in military service and still functioned. Of course, those weren't tightly hand fitted 1911s. Shake em and you hear em rattle. My point is any revolver or handgun you bring can become damaged and or rendered inop. If you exercise reasonable care when you are out and about in the field, you should be okay.
If I'm packin meat or big game hunting, I'm always carrying a rifle. I rarely carry both a rifle and a handgun. So, when I do carry only a handgun, I am mindful of it. Those occasions are usually fishing or dipnetting salmon. I'm comfortable with my revolvers and pistols and I am well aware they can all malfunction for a variety of reasons. Just like me and my rifles.
sort of what is the best car to buy...sort of depends fully on needs , wants.
But, I'll throw in my 2cents, have this one in SA/DA.
(https://www.sportsmansoutdoorsuperstore.com/prodimages/23446-DEFAULT-l.jpg)
Good advice from everyone. I agree there isn't a wrong choice. Thanks to you all for your advice.
This statement:
Quote from: mcseal2 on May 01 2019 04:14:27 PM MDT
A 1911 is not nearly as easy to field strip as the Sig 226 I have.
I totally agree with that. But when I consider dunking a handgun in proper muck when out in the field, a simple field strip often is not a deep enough level of clean, which brings me to the thought that statement evoked in my mind:
A Sig P-22X series is not nearly as easy to detail strip as a 1911.
Now, I will admit, I speak from a position of ignorance, as I have never detail stripped my P229, nor do I recall watching a video about doing so. Non-the less, a 1911 built with the need to perform deep cleans in mind can be detail stripped in the field using only the rim of a shell casing. And pretty quickly too, I might add.
You aren't going to go wrong with a good 1911, or a P220. Both are solid guns. I second the vote for a RIA, as I am fond of mine as well. I would also suggest you not give the EAA offerings like the Match, Stock, or Hunter the cold shoulder either. The Witness design is rugged and accurate, and the elite shop guns are very well made.
I had not looked at the Witness before, I'll check it out too. Thanks.
I have one of each, my 1911 is the spartan and the 220 is the Emperor Scorpion. My personal favorite is easily the 220.
I'd have to agree about the possible need to detail strip in the field. 1911s are pretty easy and don't require anything in regard to tools that you wouldn't have with you. The floorplate of a standard magazine gets the slide off and any pointy object gets pins started out. A leatherman type tool would make it very easy.
Love the 1911 in 10mm ! :P
Quote from: mcseal2 on May 02 2019 03:54:08 PM MDT
I had not looked at the Witness before, I'll check it out too. Thanks.
I have a bunch of handguns, and a bunch of 10mm's. I hope to never have to sell another gun, but if I did the 10mm's that would remain would be: Glock 20, Witness Full Size, Glock 29, Witness Match and my Para P16-40/10mm.
The Para makes the list for sentimental reasons. I did extensive custom work converting that pistol from a sow's ear P16 to a custom wide body 10mm.
So, excepting that one, the shooters to keep are the Glocks and the Witnesses.
I really like all my other 10mm's. And I like all my other handguns. But if there could only be one, it would be a tight race between the Glocks and the Witnesses. And if it was only two, it would be one of each.
Quote from: Graybeard on May 02 2019 04:55:28 PM MDT
A leatherman type tool would make it very easy.
Especially the Brownells 1911 leatherman. Great tool if you are in the field with a 1911.
Is the Brownells tool you describe the MUT that they list for AR's? I always have a Leatherman in my repair kit on the AK trips. I currently have the PST2 but could swap it out. I carry a Leatherman Wave all the time on the ranch for work.
I'm starting to think harder on the 1911 over the 220. I sure like my 1911's, and the problems I'm worried about aren't real likely to ever occur. Either gun would work well. My Glock is still having issues with the HC bullets even with the new recoil spring and barrel, I might be carrying the new 10mm I choose more than I planned to. Maybe I'll sell the Glock and get a 1911 and 220.... I think I'll get the Glock figured out and like it though, it's sure lighter than the other options.
I can't find it on Brownells site anymore, though mine is branded brownells. it is this tool:
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1007020629/caspian-1911-pocketsmith-4
That does look like a handy tool. Maybe I'll watch Ebay for one. Thanks.
Quote from: mcseal2 on May 01 2019 04:14:27 PM MDT
I like the 10mm enough I'm thinking of trading one of my other handguns in on a second 10mm. I have always liked to have 2 ways to fire any ammo I have around so I end up with 2 of everything. I recently got a Glock 20 as my first 10mm. I'm in the process of getting it set up to shoot heavy bullets to carry while hunting in bear country.
For a second one I'm leaning toward a single action only I can carry on safety with the hammer cocked for a similar purpose. I've always liked 1911's very much and am considering going that route. That said any 10mm I buy will likely get carried hunting and fishing in some nasty conditions. I fish a river that is all mud and sandbars from a jon boat with a surface drive motor. Everything I take on that river gets muddy and/or sandblasted by the time I get home, sometimes before I get home. I've moose hunted Alaska in a swamp that was awful on everything too, and plan to go to similar areas in the future. A 1911 is not nearly as easy to field strip as the Sig 226 I have. I'd hate to have a 1911 send something flying while I was reassembling it in adverse conditions 100 miles from town. The Sig does not have the grip safety which is one less place for stuff to get inside and screw something up, but is also one less safety carrying a gun cocked and locked.
I already have the Glock to use for the nasty stuff, but a second 10mm will get used much the same way. If I think there is a chance I might end up hunting with the 10mm I'd definitely take the single action over the Glock. Really anytime weight isn't a huge issue I'll take the single action over the Glock. I grew up on revolvers with worked over triggers, shoot 2lb triggers on my rifles, I love good triggers.
I'll probably shoot some mid level (1200-1250fps) 180gr ammo around home, and 200 or 220gr Underwood hardcast ammo when in bear country. I want something that can handle both without a lot of switching parts. I will never use anything lighter than the Fiocchi 180gr ammo which shows 1250fps on the box more than likely.
Whatever I choose will need to have night sights and a rail. I like to have a TLR-1 light on my handgun on the river at night, plus hiking to a spot or packing meat out after dark when hunting.
What would you choose and why?
Thanks to everyone for their help.
I second the Ruger SR1911 in 10mm. Made in the US by a US company.
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I have a Ruger SR1911 Night Watchman in 45 and really like that gun. I had a Commander size SR1911 stolen a while back. I like the Rugers, but they don't offer the rail I want on this gun. I definitely want a light rail on whatever I go with.
Quote from: mcseal2 on May 07 2019 09:32:50 AM MDT
I have a Ruger SR1911 Night Watchman in 45 and really like that gun. I had a Commander size SR1911 stolen a while back. I like the Rugers, but they don't offer the rail I want on this gun. I definitely want a light rail on whatever I go with.
I'm the one who just recommended the G20 double mag spring to you; my other 10mms are a vintage S&W 1006 and a recent purchase of a Colt Delta Elite 1911 10mm. I grew up on 1911s, and chose the Colt as it is a "Colt" and is all stainless steel to resist environmental concerns and is a 5" with just the single left side safety and a nice bump on the grip safety and Novak sights. I did not want a rail but they make a DE with one. The barrel is not as supported as other 1911s, but I shoot Underwood ammo all OK with only slight case bulges on some. I am now carrying the Colt DE with UW 180&200 XTPs with the heavy hard cast DT230 (and UW220 HC after future testing proves OK) for woods.
After doing some more looking I'm pretty well set on a Sig. I'm still waiting on my local gun store to get back with me on pricing of both the 220 Elite SAO and the 1911 Tacops 5". They both have the rail and night sights I want, and I've always had good luck with Sig. I haven't ever owned a Colt. Lots of companies make a darn good 1911 but the Sig fits my needs at a price I can handle. It comes with 4 mags if I go that route which is a plus.
Anyone know of any issues with the Sig 1911 and heavy hardcast loads?
I have the Tac ops 10mm and have no problems shooting Underwood 220 HC, Double Tap 200 gr HC or UW 200gr hc. It's been 100% so far and is one of my favorites to carry while in the back county.
Don't think you can wrong with either of the two... I also got rid of my G20 and G29...just didn't care shooting them....
As to carry in the field...don't know how you are doing it but for nasty conditions or backpacking I use the Hill People Gear Kit Bag...keeps everything dry and mud free...
Bob
Thanks everyone for the replies.
I got a couple Razco holsters for my G20, and probably will for the second 10mm I choose also. One attaches to the bottom of my FHF bino harness and uses the same straps. It makes it one less thing to take loose when layering up and down for changing weather and activity levels when hunting or scouting. The second is a plain Razco chest holster that doesn't attach to the bino harness. Both are made to fit the G20 with the Streamlight TLR-1 light attached to the rail and work great. Very good fit, design, and quality.
Whatever gun ends up going to Alaska with me I will also have him make a kydex paddle holster for to fit the gun and the light. Several of the hunting pants and rain pants I use have a built in belt to keep a low profile under the hip belt of a pack. There isn't a good place to put a holster on one. For use around camp I'd like to have a paddle holster I could slide into the pants quick without needing to get the chest holster out. It would make me less likely to not have the gun when needed if it was convenient to slide it in to go after firewood, go to the latrine area, walk to the river, etc.
My recommendations are a Plastic wonder as they all handle dirt and abuse better than a 1911. They also have a higher capacity.
So, either a G20/G40 or a SA XDm (my choice).
I ended up getting a Sig Tacops 1911 in 10mm. I traded my commander size 1911 Sig Scorpion in on it. I like the full size versions better for my use, I kept my Ruger Night Watchman SR1911. My primary carry gun is a Sig 938, I really like the 1911's.
The gun shop helped make my decision. The only SAO P220 they could get is the Kryptek hunting version. It is more expensive and doesn't have the night sights I wanted. They could get the Tacops 1911 so I could trade my 45 in on it.
I shot a few mags through it today after tearing it down and cleaning it. I had no failures of any kind I shot it well. I shot my rolling ball target that's about 6" in diameter with the 180gr Fiocchi JHP ammo. I had no trouble rolling it most every shot between 15 and 50 yards. Sights must be pretty well on for that ammo at least. I need to get a holster coming for it now since my other 1911 holsters won't fit the rail on this one. I haven't tried my bear loads through it yet.
Recoil seemed sharper than my G20 despite the extra weight. Probably due to the metal instead of polymer frame. It wasn't uncomfortable or hard to control, just felt it a little more.
I really like the new gun. I now have a really nice line-up of guns I can carry while scouting, hunting, or fishing. S&W 60, 386 XL Hunter, and 69 in 357 and 44 magnum, plus the G20 and 1911 Tacops in 10mm. Also an old Ruger P97 in 45 that likely won't see much woods use now that I have the 10mm's.
I really like the new 10mm. All the features I want (night sights, rail) with a trigger I'm already darn good at running unlike the G20.
Another 120 rounds through the Sig Tacops without an issue of any kind. I am getting even better with it as I get more used to the trigger. Man I love the flat trajectory of the 10mm at longer ranges compared to my old 230gr 45's in my other 1911! It's in the running for my favorite handgun now, it might have my 386XL Hunter beat before long.
It's 10oz heavier than the Glock G20 with both fully loaded. That's significant but not a complete deal breaker to pack hunting. If I ended up having a rifle or scope failure on a remote drop camp hunt (unlikely with my rifle but not impossible) I would feel more comfortable taking an animal with the 1911 and it's trigger. I can't take a back-up rifle on a hunt like that due to weight limits on the bush or float plane. Worst case a handgun I'm comfortable with to 50 or 60 yards might save the hunt. It's a very unlikely scenario but with multiple river crossings, terrible weather, rough terrain, and climbing something bad could happen to a rifle.
When the hunt comes around; however it goes, don't forget to give us details.
Pictures are great too!!!
Good hunting!
Thanks and sounds good. I won't be in AK again until Sept 2020, this year I hope to be in Colorado chasing mule deer. Just black bear there. I'll pack a handgun on our scouting trip but just the rifle on the hunt itself. Less danger and more walking in Colorado.