At least he had pepper spray :o
https://www.facebook.com/todd.orr/videos/10210413734089030/
Pictures of injuries
https://www.facebook.com/todd.orr/posts/10210413732648994?pnref=story
The story:
Grizzly 10/1/16
Hello everyone.
Thought I should share yesterday morning's Grizzly incident.
I took an early morning hike in the Madison valley to scout for elk. Knowing that bears are common throughout southwest Montana, I hollered out "hey bear" about every 30 seconds so as to not surprise any bears along the trail.
About three miles in, I stepped out into an open meadow and hollered again. A few more steps and I spotted a sow Grizzly bear with cubs on the trail at the upper end of the meadow. The sow saw me right away and they ran a short distance up the trail. But suddenly she turned and charged straight my way. I yelled a number of times so she knew I was human and would hopefully turn back. No such luck. Within a couple seconds, she was nearly on me. I gave her a full charge of bear spray at about 25 feet. Her momentum carried her right through the orange mist and on me.
I went to my face in the dirt and wrapped my arms around the back of my neck for protection. She was on top of me biting my arms, shoulders and backpack. The force of each bite was like a sledge hammer with teeth. She would stop for a few seconds and then bite again. Over and over. After a couple minutes, but what seemed an eternity, she disappeared.
Stunned, I carefully picked myself up. I was alive and able to walk so I headed back down the trail towards the truck 3 miles below. As I half hiked and jogged down the trail, I glanced at my injuries. I had numerous bleeding puncture wounds on my arms and shoulder but I knew I would survive and thanked god for getting me through this. I hoped the bleeding wasn't too significant. I really didn't want to stop to dress the wounds. I wanted to keep moving and put distance between us.
About five or ten minutes down the trail, I heard a sound and turned to find the Griz bearing down at 30 feet. She either followed me back down the trail or cut through the trees and randomly came out on the trail right behind me. Whatever the case, she was instantly on me again. I couldn't believe this was happening a second time! Why me? I was so lucky the first attack, but now I questioned if I would survive the second.
Again I protected the back of my neck with my arms, and kept tight against the ground to protect my face and eyes. She slammed down on top of me and bit my shoulder and arms again. One bite on my forearm went through to the bone and I heard a crunch. My hand instantly went numb and wrist and fingers were limp and unusable. The sudden pain made me flinch and gasp for breath. The sound triggered a frenzy of bites to my shoulder and upper back. I knew I couldn't move or make a sound again so I huddled motionless. Another couple bites to my head and a gash opened above my ear, nearly scalping me. The blood gushed over my face and into my eyes. I didn't move. I thought this was the end. She would eventually hit an artery in my neck and I would bleed out in the trail... But I knew that moving would trigger more bites so a laid motionless hoping it would end.
She suddenly stopped and just stood on top of me. I will never forgot that brief moment. Dead silence except for the sound of her heavy breathing and sniffing. I could feel and her breath on the back of my neck, just inches away. I could feel her front claws digging into my lower back below my backpack where she stood. I could smell the terrible pungent odor she emitted. For thirty seconds she stood there crushing me. My chest was smashed into the ground and forehead in the dirt. When would the next onslaught of biting began. I didn't move.
And then she was gone.
I tried to peek out without moving but my eyes were full of blood and I couldn't see. I thought that if she came back a third time I would be dead, so I had to do something. Staying in position on the ground, I slowly reached under my chest to grab at the pistol I was unable to get to earlier. I felt I needed something to save my life. The pistol wasn't there. I groped around again but nothing. I wiped the blood from one eye and looked around.
No bear.
The pistol and holster were lying five feet to my left. The bear's ferocious bites and pulling had ripped the straps from the pack and the holster attached to it. Now trashed, that backpack may have helped prevent many more serious bites on my back and spine.
I picked everything up and moved down the trail again. I couldn't believe I had survived two attacks. Double lucky!
Blood was still dripping off my head and both elbows and my shirt was soaked to the waist and into my pants. But a quick assessment told me I could make it another 45 minutes to the truck without losing too much blood.
I continued the jog just wanting to put more distance between that sow and I.
At the trailhead was one other vehicle. I really hoped that person didn't run into the same bear.
I snapped a couple quick photos and a video of my wounds, laid some jackets over the truck seat and headed for town. I stopped a rancher along the way and asked him to make a call to the hospital. When I got into cell service, I made a quick call to my girlfriend to ask how her morning was going, before freaking her out and asking her to bring me a change of clean clothes to the hospital.
Another call to 911 and I gave the operator a quick run down of my injuries and asked her to call the hospital and give them a heads up that I was ten minutes out.
Moments later I was met at the front door by the doctor, nurse and an officer. I had to ask the officer to open the door, put my truck in park, and unbuckle my seat belt. My left arm was useless. He was impressed I had taken the effort to buckle.
Once inside, the x-rays revealed only a chip out of the ulna bone in my forearm. Following was eight hours of stitching to put me back together. Most were arm and shoulder punctures and tears. A 5" gash along the side of my head will leave a nasty scar, but I'm hoping my balding doesn't come on too quickly and leave that one exposed. :)
And finally, this morning, numerous deep bruises and scrapes are showing up from the bites that didn't quite break the skin. Dark bruising in the shape of claws, line across my lower back and butt where the bear stood on me. Also a few more chest bruises and facial abrasions from being smashed and slammed into the ground.
Not my best day, but I'm alive.
So thankful I'm here to share with all of you. :)
In a couple weeks I will have to clean out the truck a little better. My girlfriend says it looks like I had gutted an elk in the drivers seat.
Todd Orr. Skyblade Knives.
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I invited him to the forum. We need a Grizzly expert and I think he rocks a RIA 10mm 8)
WOW!! :o :o Intercooler, is he a friend of yours? he is a very lucky man. i hope he recovers well!
Not a personal friend, but hope to see him here.
Twice attacked by a bear in one day. That's got to be a first. The guy is very lucky.
Staying in position on the ground, I slowly reached under my chest to grab at the pistol I was unable to get to earlier. I felt I needed something to save my life. The pistol wasn't there. I groped around again but nothing. I wiped the blood from one eye and looked around.
No bear.
The pistol and holster were lying five feet to my left
Glad that he survived....
But I would have pulled out the pistol at the first step towards me ( instead of the pepper spray). Why didn't he??
Hell, I pulled the gun and held on a 150lb black bear as I backed away.
( btw, 10mm, 200xtp head, copy of DT load with 800x )
Harrowing tale of survival. Very fortunate to be alive. Absolutely incredible that same bear circled back and attacked him again. :o
Wow....
Quote from: tommac919 on October 03 2016 06:55:43 AM MDT
[...]
But I would have pulled out the pistol at the first step towards me ( instead of the pepper spray). Why didn't he??
[...]
I had the same reaction.
It makes you think a little about being away from civilization a distance without anyone with you. Maybe the running gear needs more to be on the safe side!
I wonder why he didn't use his gun the first time. I would have had it out.
I guess this proves that bear spray isn't worth a darn. Good. I now have more reason to carry my G20.
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Cropped from US. Fish and Wildlife Service fact sheet #8 & Wikipedia
Bear Spray vs. Bullets:
"U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service have experience that supports this reality --
based on their investigations of human-bear encounters since 1992, persons encountering grizzlies and
defending themselves with firearms suffer injury about 50% of the time. During the same period, persons
defending themselves with pepper spray escaped injury most of the time, and those that were injured
experienced shorter duration attacks and less severe injuries."
Wikipedia:
A 2008 "Efficacy of Bear Deterrent Spray in Alaska" study stated:
"Red pepper spray stopped bears' undesirable behavior 92% of the time when used on brown bears, 90% for black bears, and 100% for polar bears.
Of all persons carrying sprays, 98% were uninjured by bears in close-range encounters.
All bear-inflicted injuries (n = 3) associated with defensive spraying involved brown bears and were relatively minor (i.e., no hospitalization required).
In 7% (5 of 71) of bear spray incidents, wind was reported to have interfered with spray accuracy, although it reached the bear in all cases.
In 14% (10 of 71) of bear spray incidents, users reported the spray having had negative side effects upon themselves, ranging from minor irritation (11%, 8 of 71) to near incapacitation (3%, 2 of 71).
Been nose to nose with some ferocious, well armed & capable beasts but nothing remotely close to a pissed off Momma Grizzly so impossible to know to a certainty how I'd handle it. However, I feel pretty confident after being used as a chew toy during the 1st encounter, I'd have been trotting out of the wilderness with my 10mm in hand.... But there is every likelihood the victim was already in shock at that point.
Bear spray works better...ok?
But also, with chest holtster, I would have had a long gun in woods with known bears.
Quote from: tommac919 on October 03 2016 07:22:24 PM MDT
Bear spray works better...ok?
I'm not certain it does, just passing on info I found on the topic.. Just because a Federal Agency says so, doesn't necessarily make it the truth... Been too many examples of that recently to count >:(
I do agree that If I was hiking through area "common" for Griz; very likely to be carrying a long gun, side arm & bear spray.
bear spray:
(http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/images/N.O.E._Bullet_Moulds_360-280-SP_(PB).Jpg)
bear sprayer:
(http://fellingfamily.net/images/ar10_358.jpg)
Thinking about building an AR pistol version of this gun that would be my truck gun. With my CCW I could carry it loaded.
Quote from: Rojo27 on October 03 2016 07:51:25 PM MDT
Quote from: tommac919 on October 03 2016 07:22:24 PM MDT
Bear spray works better...ok?
I'm not certain it does, just passing on info I found on the topic.. Just because a Federal Agency says so, doesn't necessarily make it the truth... Been too many examples of that recently to count >:(
I do agree that If I was hiking through area "common" for Griz; very likely to be carrying a long gun, side arm & bear spray.
A Government agency that is most likely staffed by anti-gunners.
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A Government agency that is most likely staffed by anti-gunners.
#bearslivesmatter
This is like the 5th griz encounter this year in MT. One was a fatal. One other was in an area not known for the griz. My G40 may or may not work but we all meet our maker someday. It might be the bear, it might be me. If I ever use it for DLP they will find 16 empty Underwood cases.
I am always astonished and impressed with real, first-hand incidents of threats and survival. I have never been in such a position and never hope to.
My hat's off to this gentleman and others who were "tested" and lived to tell about it.
God has funny/unusal ways of getting our attention sometimes?..............
Pat
Quote from: Buckeye 50 on October 05 2016 01:40:13 PM MDT
I am always astonished and impressed with real, first-hand incidents of threats and survival. I have never been in such a position and never hope to.
...
Pat
One year while hunting I walked down a dusty road that would easily show any prints of animals that walked through it. In the morning while walking away from my truck I saw a few deer and racoon tracks. At dusk, on the way back, I noticed some very large cat paw prints. The cat (mountain lion) paws were almost as big as my hands, and I have large hands. The cat was following my footprints. I do not know how close it got to me. I never saw anything while I was hunting.
On another hunting trip I was sleeping in the back of my pickup truck. Some time during the night I though I heard something near my truck. I didn't want to pop my head up, but I did grab my pistol and held it so I could shoot anything that peered over the truck's bed rail. Nothing ever showed its face. In the morning I was small (black) bear prints next to my truck. I looked like the bear just walked past. The tracks didn't circle around the truck or stop.
When I was in my 20's and early 30's, I wasn't afraid of anything in the wilderness. When I was in my mid 30's to late 40's, I was only afraid of bears and mountain lions. Now I don't care about mountain lions or bears. I am only afraid of serial killers (people).
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Quote from: Grizdad on October 04 2016 06:23:45 PM MDT
This is like the 5th griz encounter this year in MT. One was a fatal. One other was in an area not known for the griz. My G40 may or may not work but we all meet our maker someday. It might be the bear, it might be me. If I ever use it for DLP they will find 16 empty Underwood cases.
I just moved back to MT after many years, and we've already had black bears in our neighborhood... The deer/elk general season starts soon, and I'll be out hunting carrying either a G29 or G40 as backup...
I'll be hunting areas close to me, and I'm only 60 miles away from the guy that suffered multiple attacks...
I never thought about spray/personal protection while hunting before, but it seems to be prudent now... Wasn't planning on carrying spray, too, but hey, it's light...
Didn't consider the "gun was 5' away" part of the story, I wonder if he had a hip holster or a chest holster...
Ah well, more stuff to carry, I'm just hoping to get something!
Staying in position on the ground, I slowly reached under my chest to grab at the pistol
I would say/guess chest holster... always in front, handy and doesn't hit a pack if you wear one.
Maybe I'll carry both bear sprays... The can and this...
(http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa437/CoSchrambo/e6a7dc14-0364-4fbd-976f-d8137fe32a6c_zps4q15q5ky.jpg) (http://s1197.photobucket.com/user/CoSchrambo/media/e6a7dc14-0364-4fbd-976f-d8137fe32a6c_zps4q15q5ky.jpg.html)
I've never had to shoot of spray a bear but at least with rounds in her she's dieing instead of continuously chewing on you taking her time. Then coming back for you a half mile down the trail for seconds.
Quote from: Grizdad on October 04 2016 06:23:45 PM MDT
This is like the 5th griz encounter this year in MT. ...
Grizzly bears don't like illegal immigration in their area.
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Update on the hiker's condition:
http://www.grindtv.com/random/grizzly-bear-attack-survivor-tough-guy-even-surgery/?ref=yfp#AImZbUCzXYDs4KI5.97
More info on fatal bear attacks in State & Federal Parks (and probably the 1st Vox article I've ever posted a link to)
http://www.vox.com/2016/10/6/13170344/bear-attacks-national-state-parks?yptr=yahoo
Son and I hiked Yellowstone a few years back in late summer. Went to park ranger station for hiking trail maps. Was told we were in the area where more Grizzlies were than anywhere in park. This old guy tried to sell me on the $50 black bottle of bear spray. Told me all about it. I opened my jacked and showed him my Glock 20. He immediately said, If you discharge that weapon in the park we're gonna have to come get you. I said, That'll be fine. He told me I'd be better off with the spray. He said bears Bluff Charge. I told him, I don't bluff. We went on our way. Never saw a grizzly while hiking but felt that I was well armed with a 10mm and 15+1 and an additional 15 in a spare mag.
Quote from: Rvrrat14 on October 08 2016 07:40:28 PM MDT
... I opened my jacked and showed him my Glock 20. He immediately said, If you discharge that weapon in the park we're gonna have to come get you. I said, That'll be fine. He told me I'd be better off with the spray. He said bears Bluff Charge. I told him, I don't bluff. We went on our way. Never saw a grizzly while hiking but felt that I was well armed with a 10mm and 15+1 and an additional 15 in a spare mag.
It is your word against the bears, and even if the bear survives they won't get much information out of him/her.
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The survivor is one heck of a guy, twice attacked. I've got a ton of respect for his fortuitous opportunity to live another day.
I've spent a lot of time in bear country and the spray comes out first, then the handgun. In my case a Glock 20 with 200gr Hard Cast.
If I wasn't carrying climbing gear or heavy backpack, I'd take a shotgun with 12ga Magnum slugs.
I'm still amazed he survived. KUDOS!