What manufacturer do you guys recommend. I have a Forster single stage which I love but it would be nice to increase my output while decreasing the time it takes.
So Dillon, Lee, Redding and why?
I have a Hornady think it is great value works very well. Dillon wrote the book.
(http://www.hornady.com/store/images/P/095160_ammo_plant_lg.jpg)
Because you can't get more for less. They've pretty much got the bugs worked out. It's the least hands on. Change overs are super-fast if you already have other dies set up compared to Dillon where the only way it's just as quick for changeovers is to swap out the whole toolhead which costs lots more money yet. And blah blah blah. It's what I would choose if I were in the market.
There's a lot of different ways to look at choosing a press. If cost is a factor you're probably stuck with Lee which some guys are more than happy with. If cost isn't a factor there is Hornady and Dillon. Then there's RCBS, but when it comes to progressives they don't seem to have much over the others. Ten years ago, yeah, but not now.
If I ever do go full progressive it will be Hornady unless there's a major change in what's available if and when I ever buy. My next step will simply be a Redding T-7 turrent press which already speeds up the load process by leaps and bounds compared to a single stage. Time will tell if I ever decide to take it further than the T-7.
It is a tough decision though. There's a lot of quality stuff out there in this day and age. It pretty much will boil down to the best balance of the speed you want with as many features and refinements over another as you can afford.
That's my 2 cents, I could be wrong. :D
I am still a single stage guy, but when I jump it will be for big red like Redline. Same reason. Hornady has a rep for standing behind their equipment. The Lock-n-Load AP is comparable in features to a Dillon 650, but is far less money. The die holders are cheap and make changes easy.
I have a friend who has a lee Pro-1000 and loves it. But, he did have to tinker some to get it running. Primer feed is the issue. And it would not serve my needs in 30-06 or 308.
The only thing wrong with Dillon Blue is the cost. I have a square deal B on my bench. It belongs to a friend who doesn't have a place to mount it so it lives at my house. But he doesn't have 10mm dies, the SDB dies are proprietary and for the cost of a 10mm conversion I could buy a Lee Pro-1000. So, I am holding out for a L-n-L AP from Horndady.
Well I have a Dillon 550B but it sits in a box mostly, WHY! I'm waiting for a 10mm/40S&W/357Sig/9x25 shell plate of which I have bid on one for this press. If and when I get this shell plate, I will set the Dillon up for 40S&W, I have several thousand of those to load up.
I have been running so much used 10mm & 40S&W brass that I polish in the virba tumbler, then I resize it all using the pass-thru method, this allows for inspection before and after. This step has been fantastic for reconditioning and sorting the brass.
I deprime it all and do the neck expansion and priming. Therefore the brass is all done and perpared all that is left to do is hand weigh charges place a bullet and seat, then crimp. It does take time but the rewards of doing it that way has paid dividens of quality ammo.
I will continue to do the single stage operation for the max loads because working this close to the upper limits warrants me doing these this way.
I have had a Dillon 550 for for about 12 years, an it has loaded thousands of rounds. A couple of years ago, I was having trouble seating primers. Looked the press over, and the bottom where the handle attaches was broken. I call Dillon and got a return number, and sent it out on a Friday morning. It was sitting on my front porch the following Thursday, repaired and no charge. That is GREAT! service.
Is there any progressive press manufacturer that anyone knows to have below average warranty coverage?
It seems now-a-days you can call any one of them and very shortly afterward have a new whatever-you-need, that broke or simply became inoperable, on the way to your front door at zero cost to you.
Am I wrong on that?
Redline that is my setup exactly. I like it change over is pretty fast but it still takes time but load 1000 rounds in between it is worth it.
I can see where you're coming from that change overs still take time when you're dealing with not only the press as in most cases, but also with case and bullet feeders too. Can't really count that against the press itself though.
I am glad to hear you are happy with the setup. Unless something drastic changes with presses in the future to change my mind, someday I'll probably have that same setup. Heck, I can't wait till I have the money just for components to keep something like that running and worth having around.
I am 99% leaning towards Hornady. The Hornady stuff I have is awesome so I'd assume it'll follow suit. Thanks guys
For what it's worth I have two dillons, the 550 and the 650. If you are going to buy a dillon for loading any real volume get the 650, I just don't use the 550 anymore as with manual index and no case feed it's that much slower.
I know there is a Dillon fan boi club out there and they do make great products but they are not perfect and some functions like the primer system and the so called "quick change" and the powder measure adjustment all give me the shits.
In anycase if you are still in single stage land move up into the thin air and get a progessive. It frees up time to go shooting and makes you instant friends.
Oh importantly and this is something that I wish I was told people that quote 1000's of rounds loaded per hour are either olympic quality atheletes or have a team of people working for them. I loaded 500 rounds in one sitting ONCE and I was stuffed from pulling the handle and paying close attention... Try to pace out your work.
The bushing setup of the Hornady is really appealing.
I can't think of anything not appealing in the Hornady.
In terms of swapping calibers, lol. Although I will probably only be running 223 for a little while. I only have 10mm and 223 and the 10mm gets run on my Forster single stage.
I could still see you using the progressive for plinking loads (not necessarily weak loads, but not for regular carry either) in the furture. I mean, if you want to pound out a thousand or so at a time just for range fodder, the progressive starts looking much more appealing. While still using the Forster for the good stuff.
Quote from: REDLINE on November 01 2012 10:21:45 PM MDT
I could still see you using the progressive for plinking loads (not necessarily weak loads, but not for regular carry either) in the furture. I mean, if you want to pound out a thousand or so at a time just for range fodder, the progressive starts looking much more appealing. While still using the Forster for the good stuff.
I think you hit the nail on the head.
LOL It's just a matter of time and you'll be pounding them out like there's no tomorrow. That's awesome. I simply can't wait till I can afford the Redding T-7 turret press, let alone an all out progressive like the Hornady Lock-N-Load Ammo Plant. Good luck with the ongoing venture!
I am a BLUE person. Dillon all the way. I have 2 Dillon presses and have been using Dillon products for 21 years. Any problem at all is fixed by DILLON no charge. I once had a broken return spring on one of my powder measures fail ; (after 12,000 rounds) a call to Dillon and I received a brand new complete powder measure no charge. (it was the improved model; works great)
I shoot 3000 rounds a month sometimes. My Dillon 1050 seriously loads an easy 1000 rounds per hour. One man I know has loaded 1000 rounds in 33 minutes all by himself. I'am not that dedicated but once in a while my kids (adults and one still at home) come out to my reloading Gun Room and pump out ammo for the weekend.
I load 10MM on my Dillon 550B with case feeder. Capacity is around 700 per hour but when reloading 10 I am never in a hurry....hehe. Incredible machine the 550.
The Dillon 1050 is perhaps the best reloader in the world. Costly but worth the $ if you or your family is serious about shooting/guns/collecting/ammo costs.
Good reading on which Dillon and costs here:
http://brianenos.com/pages/dillon.html
Here is my Reloading Den.
(http://i51.tinypic.com/2zhr33r.jpg)
Very nice oceanbob. 8)
Very nice!!
I have not used the BLUE stuff, but I have nothing but good things to say about my Hornady LNL
every time I use it i think to myself: "man this thing is cool!"
oceanbob, glad to see you come on board here. That Dillon stuff is quite nice. I am going to set up my 550B someday soon.
I have a ton of 40S&W to knock out, still need a 40 cal powder thru expander to get it going with the powder drop.
I have 2 550's and a 650. After 20 years I only use Dillon their warranties are truly no BS.
I have used a Hornady Progressive Press for well over 25 years. I now have 2 as I like to have one set up for rifle and one for 45Colt.
I keep hearing that the dillon is a far superior press and have purchased a few over time when I have found them at a bargain price. The SDB is only a 4 station press and you cannot use any other dies than dillon. I like the Lee die for crimping... not on the dillon. The 550 is a manual indexing press....not a progressive press... can you say double charge?? The 650 is a nice press but as stated way more costly then the Hornady and compared to my older Hornady presses the 650 has many small, frail parts made of plastic.
The powder measure on the Hornady is much better then the Dillon as well, You can buy a good powder measure and put it on the 650 or even the 550 if you do buy a Dillon
Keep in mind that Hornady has customer service that is second to none! Everything from press questions to load data
Quote from: Hairtrigger on November 25 2012 06:17:18 AM MST
I have used a Hornady Progressive Press for well over 25 years. I now have 2 as I like to have one set up for rifle and one for 45Colt.
I keep hearing that the dillon is a far superior press and have purchased a few over time when I have found them at a bargain price. The SDB is only a 4 station press and you cannot use any other dies than dillon.
Not true I use Lee crimp dies on my Dillon. I would say at least 2/3rds of my dies are not Dillon.
Quote from: ivanimal on November 25 2012 06:25:08 PM MST
Quote from: Hairtrigger on November 25 2012 06:17:18 AM MST
I have used a Hornady Progressive Press for well over 25 years. I now have 2 as I like to have one set up for rifle and one for 45Colt.
I keep hearing that the dillon is a far superior press and have purchased a few over time when I have found them at a bargain price. The SDB is only a 4 station press and you cannot use any other dies than dillon.
Not true I use Lee crimp dies on my Dillon. I would say at least 2/3rds of my dies are not Dillon.
I think the Square Deal Dillon uses a different thread size to normal dies, so you are limited to the Dillon versions. You can use other dies in the 550,650 and 1050 presses.
The 550 does rely on the user to move the shell plate and it could result in a double charge, but if you short stroke the 650 or any other press you can get a double charge also. As with all reloading you need to pay attention.
I need to make a decision, I've loaded about 300 rounds of 223 the last couple days. Along with processing about 500 cartridges through sizing/deprime, trimming and tumbling. Progressive is what I need. Just need to decide and buy. Although I just got an iPhone 5 my wife may put me on hold.
Quote from: ivanimal on November 25 2012 06:25:08 PM MST
Quote from: Hairtrigger on November 25 2012 06:17:18 AM MST
I have used a Hornady Progressive Press for well over 25 years. I now have 2 as I like to have one set up for rifle and one for 45Colt.
I keep hearing that the dillon is a far superior press and have purchased a few over time when I have found them at a bargain price. The SDB is only a 4 station press and you cannot use any other dies than dillon.
Not true I use Lee crimp dies on my Dillon. I would say at least 2/3rds of my dies are not Dillon.
The SDB will NOT use 7/8-14 thread dies and will NOT load most rifle calibers
Anything Dillon but the square deal B uses standard dies, but the square deal B uses proprietary dies. That is where the deal becomes less square. Cost of a set of dies is very high.
Dillon 650 here because of their reputation, customer service, quality, etc.
I use a lee pro 1000. I know alot of people say it is a crap loader by I have had no troubles with mine at all. I loaded around 3000 rounds this summer so it worked well for me.
I have a co-worker who has a Pro-1000 and really likes it. He read and watched all the fluff-n-buff/tune up tutorials online and gave his primer system some TLC, but has been very, very pleased with it. I may just order a Load Master in 308. I need a set of dies for that caliber anyway, and the press is only $223 with dies. Dies would cost me $30 at the local warehouse, so, the press is under $200.
Even if it sucks for priming, I can combine flare, charge, seat and crimp which will save me TONS of time.
Quote from: sqlbullet on November 28 2012 08:31:01 AM MST
I have a co-worker who has a Pro-1000 and really likes it. He read and watched all the fluff-n-buff/tune up tutorials online and gave his primer system some TLC, but has been very, very pleased with it. I may just order a Load Master in 308. I need a set of dies for that caliber anyway, and the press is only $223 with dies. Dies would cost me $30 at the local warehouse, so, the press is under $200.
Even if it sucks for priming, I can combine flare, charge, seat and crimp which will save me TONS of time.
There's no flare or crimp with .308's. No charge, either (no "powder through expander die", and no expander die). You'll have to charge with a universal dispenser. Use what you use already, or pony up some cash for one.
If you are shooting the rounds through the same rifle, or multiple "chamber friendly" rifles, you only need a neck sizer and bullet seater dies. You may already have a seating die, and it doesn't have to be ".308". Any seating die with the correct profile stem that will accept/align the case will work as well as any. That leaves only a neck sizer die. If you shoot them through several, or unknown rifles/chambers, the need for full length sizing may be necessary. Neck-only sizing often extends (indefinitely) brass life, and can improve accuracy dramatically. If you can easily chamber any fired case from any of your rifles into all the other rifles, you don't need full length sizing. A carbide neck sizer eliminates the need for lube (although I use it anyway).
And, I actually do flare my 308. I load them with a Lee 200 grain hard cast lead bullet, so they get a touch of flare from a lyman M die and then a heavy crimp from a Lee FCD. And yes, I already have 308 dies, but I don't have a backup set yet like I do for all my other calibers.
But I was actually referring to when I had my 10mm dies on the Load-Master. :)
Late to the party but thought I would weight in....
I started reloading in the 90s with a Lee Turret Press, added 2 Load Masters, then 2 Dillon 650s, a Dillon 1050, a Lee Pro 1000, a Lee Breech Lock Challenger and some shotgun presses. Today I have one Dillon 650, one 1050, and the Lee Breech Lock Challenger (I just sold the original turret press about a year ago). Sorry I cannot give you any feedback on the Hornady but that is one of the few presses I have never used. Here are quick thoughts on all I have used:
Lee Turret press: great simple press if you are loading a few hundred rounds at a time. Simple to use. I added another Turret press with the auto index feature later but I found the plastic bushing for the Auto-Index to be a weakness and preferred rotating the tool head by hand. Great press and inexpensive for setting up tons of calibers in their own tool head and quickly switching back and forth without having to monkey with dies.
Lee Load Master: probably the best press for the money! Same tool head design so I had multiple tool heads that allowed a quick change between calibers. The Achilles heel of this press is the primer feed system but since you can by 3 of these for the price of a Dillon 650 do the math. If you buy one of these the coveted secret is that you will need two sizing dies. One goes in the normal sizing/depriming station and the second one, with the deprimer removed, goes in station 2 to hold the case securely while inserting the primer. If you do this you rarely have a problem with the Loadmaster.
Dillon 650 is a great all-round press for those who are loading lots of ammo with no military brass and Dillon support is good AS LONG AS YOU DO NOT ALSO ADD A 1050 (more about this later). Dillon is expensive up front and expensive to add more calibers to. In fact, you can almost buy a Loadmaster in a new caliber for what the additional parts cost to change calibers in a 650 (you could definitely buy a Pro1000). The 650 primer system is the best out there period, dependable and safe.
Dillon 1050 - great press if you are loading lots of ammo that includes military brass. There is a swager built in that removes the crimp on military brass primer pockets. Very very expensive to get into and crazy expensive to have multiple tool heads and calibers. Just a tool head with no dies or conversion kit is almost $200. ALSO Dillon considers this a "commercial" machine and warranty is only a year. Furthermore if you have a 650 and a 1050 and call for service you get the 3rd degree so they are comfortable that you are not trying to get free support for your 1050. Primer system is temperamental and a primer that fails to seat creates a domino effect, a real PITA!
Lee Pro 1000 - not as robust as the Loadmaster, very fragile primer system, issues with the powder measure that comes standard, and not enough die positions. But they are inexpensive. There is an upgraded powder measure that eases the pain there but I consider 5 holes in a tool heat the minimum.
Lee Breech Lock Challenger - love this press. Single stage but I have a 2nd or 3rd set of dies for every caliber I load on the progressive presses with a breech lock on it so I can load every caliber single stage. This is what I use for all my rifle except 223. I use the 1050 for 223 unless I want match 223 then I use this press. It is amazing how much more judicious I am pulling the trigger when I have to load the ammo on a single stage press! :P
Couple more notes...
1st - I DO NOT recommend a Dillon 550. A press like the Loadmaster or Pro-1000, while not as robust or heavy duty, auto-indexes which greatly reduces the chance of a double charge. I have seen a half dozen different folks blow mags out of the bottom of their Glocks and when asked what press they use I always get "a 550". Especially if you are new to reloading, get a press that auto-indexes so when the kids come up to say hi or the phone rings and you get side tracked you almost completely eliminate the ability to double charge a case.
2nd - No matter what press you have you have to pay attention, go slow initially and then do not get complacent. If something does not feel right is probably isn't so stop and make sure rather than applying more pressure.
3rd and last - know how your press works and keep it clean!!! No matter which press you buy you will end up taking it apart to clean it or to diagnose a problem. If you understand how it works you will be light-year ahead in making safe, quality ammo!
4th - Ok I lied, this is the last one.... A Lee Factory Crimp Die is a must have for every caliber.
I love my dillon 650. Its my first press and learned how to reload on it.
I first got it with no casefeeder, and I was loading 40s&w. The tube would hold about 20 case before I had to refill the tube. If you go slow and watch everything it was very easy for a beginner. At first I ran about 500 rounds just to decap and get used to the press.
I have loaded over 10k rounds through this press and have had zero problems.
The dillon customer service is awesome.
I lost the plastic primer follower thing that activates the low primer alarm. I think the cat took it for a toy. I called them and told them that and asked if I could buy another. It didnt break I lost it. My fault!
They would not let me pay for one and shipped it free of charge!
I would also recommend Brian enos. I ordered everything through him. He is a great guy. I ordered a powder check system through him once and when I got it one of the rods were a little bent. I called him and explaned what was wrong and he sent me a new one.
Orders over $400 have free shipping also!
Brianenos.com
I have had and seen similar results from both RCBS and Hornady.
A couple years ago a friend gave me a Lachmiller lubrisizer that had a broken yoke. Called up RCBS to order a replacement part and was sent the part free of charge.
My neighbor recently was given an old broken Pacific single stage C press. The body was find, but some of the linkage parts were broken. He called Hornady see if they had parts he could buy. They sent him a complete rebuild kit for his press free of charge, and offered to rebuild it for him if he would send it in.
Both examples of solid companies standing behind products they built or that were built by companies they bought.
Can't say enough about my 650 but many friends have red, blue and green and never found anyone that felt any one press flawless. But will keep my blue! Regard to Brian Enos, great guy!! Never go wrong with him!
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