After several boxes of VERY bad 10mm hardcast from Doubletap, I changed to Underwood. I am getting ready to wring out a new KKM 40 Super conversion barrel for my Glock 30. Underwood is limited on it's current selection of 40 Super. I am still leery of Doubletap quality, because of my bad experience a couple of years back. Does anyone here know if the quality control at Doubletap has improved. This is a "woods gun" for me, so performance matters.
Here are a few questions that I have trying to find out your experience with the G-30...
What kind of issues did you encounter with the DT ammo? Was this the 40Super ammo in the KKM conversion barrel?
Was it a Failure to fully feed and chamber to lockup?
What recoil spring system and spring weights were you running?
The only issue I had with my G-30 was shooting my own cast bullets where a small bit of alloy scraped off as the bullet transitioned the end of chamber cut and it held the next cartridge back for full battery. Quick brushing of the bore and chamber cleared this right up.
The issues that I had with doubletap ammo were best explained by these pictures. These were typical of both the weights of 10mm Hardcast that I received.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v232/cadjak/Misc%20Firearms/10mm%20guns%20and%20ammo/CIMG3428_zps1095e35b.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/cadjak/media/Misc%20Firearms/10mm%20guns%20and%20ammo/CIMG3428_zps1095e35b.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v232/cadjak/Misc%20Firearms/10mm%20guns%20and%20ammo/photobucket-44359-1349209580689.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/cadjak/media/Misc%20Firearms/10mm%20guns%20and%20ammo/photobucket-44359-1349209580689.jpg.html)
I contacted doubletap and they offered to replace them. I thought, "I better stay away from their hardcast" and requested 200gr Nosler 10mm as the replacement. Here is what I received(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v232/cadjak/Misc%20Firearms/10mm%20guns%20and%20ammo/CIMG3454A-1.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/cadjak/media/Misc%20Firearms/10mm%20guns%20and%20ammo/CIMG3454A-1.jpg.html).
My G30 10MM KKM conversion works perfectly with every 10mm I have tried in it. I had great help from Kevin Mcintire, the late owner of KKM. I simply changed the springs and rod to 23lb Wolff and followed Kevin's instructions for modding the stock Glock extractor and I was done. I can just swap the OEM Glock .45 acp barrel back in and it works fine as a .45
Those pictures of the Doubletap ammo were from a couple of years ago. Prior to that I bought a lot of my ammo from them. Doubletap pioneered bringing full strength 10mm back. They used to be a good company and may still be. We need all the good ammo makers that we can get. I just lost confidence in buying from them. I figured if those hardcast made it through quality control, what else might be off. Something I couldn't see from the outside. I posted my question here hoping to get an update on peoples experience with current Doubletap quality .
Yep That's cool.
It seems I did see those pictured previously. They cased them without the mold being hot enough for the alloy to fill out, they should never accepted them as cast. Very poor quality casting...
Have you considered handloading?
I've considered it. I've loaded at a friends place with his instruction. It isn't rocket science, but I live in a tiny place and I don't know if I trust my attention span. :))
Quote from: ennis on July 14 2015 07:06:32 PM MDT
I've considered it. I've loaded at a friends place with his instruction. It isn't rocket science, but I live in a tiny place and I don't know if I trust my attention span. :))
Get a Lee hand press! Hardly any room taken up. As for your attention span I have no answers. ;)
Heck...A lee loader will work. :-)
Quote from: sqlbullet on July 16 2015 11:47:27 AM MDT
Heck...A lee loader will work. :-)
Yes it will... but I'm glad I don't anymore.
Dad used to make me do 38s and 30 carbine on them a long time ago.... that and lee dippers ! :)
Some pretty bad looking ammo there. My doubletap is older but looked very well put together. Heck, it had better for what I paid for it.
My reason for posting here was to find out if Doubletap's quality control has improved in their recent production. It would also be good to know if their published data now reflects real performance. Losing them as a source of "real" 10mm was hard. :(
Intercooler has recently retested Doubletap. They really seem to be doing a good product lately, though their prices have always been steep. Here goes from looking them up: 135 gr 1724 fps!!!! ;D :D 8), 155 gr 1451, 165 gr 1373, 180 gr 1251, 200 gr hardcast 1191, 200 gr nosler 1156. These loads are quite great. I think they need to work on there 200 grain loading a bit but all the others do the caliber justice.
I recently bought Double Tap 9X25 and 10mm. Both seem to be fine (no Chrono though), visual appearance good.
Although I have never bought Doubletap ammo, I have quite a few nickle plated cases with their headstamp on them. I wonder who really makes their brass?
Quote from: gandog56 on July 29 2015 06:51:05 AM MDT
Although I have never bought Doubletap ammo, I have quite a few nickle plated cases with their headstamp on them. I wonder who really makes their brass?
It depends. Early nickel and plain brass was Starline. Later (last 5-7 years) is not, according to McNett, and wouldn't say where/who makes the newer brass. There was a period in between those that had a "McNett" headstamp. If you have any of that, steer clear! I bought a bunch of them and ultimately had them recalled. Complete brass failure, even at very low, starting loads. I documented that on GT with pics, don't remember if I repeated that here.
DM1906, I remember that you had some issues, it was thought that DT was using an overseas brass maker, as he moved away from Starline products a few years ago. I'm not sure if he has returned to Starline or not... ???
I've spoke with them several times over the last several years. They were "proud" to claim Starline at a time they used them. Not so "proud" to claim any brass manufacturer, now. They wouldn't claim the supplier of the failed "McNett" brass, and wouldn't say it is a different supplier now. If it were Starline, they would say. They're not. I suspect whoever is supplying their current brass may be "less than desireable", to some of us.
I was friends with Bill Bramlett who owned Ballistic Supply, when they were still in Moses Lake, WA. Ballistic Supply only loaded 500 S&W. We were out shooting. Besides Bill's product, I was shooting some Magtech 500s (hey, they were cheaper).. Afterwards I asked Bill if he thought I should save the brass to reload. He measured the Magtech stuff and the brass was MUCH thinner at the web than the new Starline that Bill uses. My point being, if I am buying a warmish 10mm load, from any manufacturer, brass quality matters a lot. Not good that Doubletap is using brass from unknown sources. To be fair, I will check with the McNetts and ask whose brass they use. The internet can easily spread bad news. I want to at least try to get the info directly from the source.
I have probably bought maybe four boxes of commercial 10mm ammo ever. The first when when I got my first 10mm pistol, and trial boxes of some Underwood and Ted Nugent brands. I can't tell you how many 10mm's I have ever reloaded, it's probably in the 10's of thousands.