BATFE To Ban Common AR-15 Ammo, I sure a few of you all have seen this, especially those in the NRA.
https://www.nraila.org/articles/20150213/batfe-to-ban-common-ar-15-ammo
SAw this yesterday.
What a crock..
Have been following a thread on the M14Forum on this:
http://m14forum.com/m16-ar15/174259-5-56-m855-banned.html
Note my post on page 2:
http://m14forum.com/m16-ar15/174259-5-56-m855-banned-2.html#post1520629
"Remember Boys and Girls....
The Second Amendment;
"A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed" does not cover AMMO !
This includes Cases / Hulls, Bullets / Shot, Powder and Primers
Imagine that, they can ban any and all Ammo (and their components) from personal / privet purchase and there is nothing, not a thing that says they can't
Kinds sucks right ?"
THAT is what keeps me awake at night ! ! !
They've been banning ammo for years. Now guys finally care when it's 5.56. Many guys have said, "I've got no dog in this fight", when certain 7.62x39 and 5.45x39 were banned.
If you're not one of the 'don't upset the apple cart' guys, write a letter and make some calls.
Funny because M193 pierces armor better than M855 at close range.
I've never been a fan of M855, but obviously this is unconstitutional. If M855 is armor piercing, then just about all rifle ammo is.
Didn't this whole morass start with the Winchester Black Talon, which wasn't armor piercing BTW.
...and if you read the actual notice from the BATF&E it refers to "no sporting purpose" throughout the whole ruling.
Now that the 2nd has been ruled an individual right of We The People, one would think that sporting purpose has nothing to do with anything being restricted or our rights to own it "infringed".
Earl, exactly, chipping away a small piece at a time of the block. can start it crumbling!
It has always been about CONTROL! ???
Given an inch, the bastards will not stop at a mile either!
You have to wonder when they will try to declare a "Marshall Law" type fiasco...or set the wheels in motion to civil uprising!
Once it starts then, things will be a "hell storm"! :o
Naturally, there is a whitehouse petition up, but these things are usually laughed at by the administration and then targeted as items they need to go after.
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/stop-batfe-banning-xm855-ammunition/XrvVh1cj
The Republican House and Senate would never let this happen.
I guess everyone has forgotten (or worse, don't care about) the lessons of the Nazi's from the 1930's.........................
Pat
Well, I guess that takes care of any thoughts I might have had of getting one if this sh#$t from this asshole in the White House continues? >:(
Pat
Quote from: Wolfie link=topic=3729.msg40198#msg40198 date=1424. 104154
The Republican House and Senate would never let this happen.
They would have to vote to de-fund the agency.
Let's not pretend that the BATFE is not taking orders from the potus...
Just got back from the gun store and there is a run on this ammo and they will not amp up production.
But there is good news, .22 ammo is available and dropping in price.
I would like to thank Obama for all the extra .22 ammo out there that is cheap.
The NRA-ILA states it was a result of King Obama's EOs. Which one? I'm not sure there was one specifically addressing this.
My guess, it has trickled down through the WH to the BATF to change their interpretation; which is in their confines to do....not that I like it....but as Shadow stated, you give them an mm and they take a mile! This has been a lot of what King Obama likes to do, that and issue executive orders and memos. All presidents do this; unfortunately, this president has done more EOs and EMs than any other president to get their agenda through.
Hence, voting matters.
I think they are using a portion of Nixons guns laws that protect law enforcement as justification.
Wouldn't be surprised......although, why now? ;)
Tit for tat and its stupid.
Quote from: Wolfie on February 17 2015 12:31:40 PM MST
Tit for tat and its stupid.
Yep......but it's politics...not an excuse....it'll still happen in the centuries to come. :(
It is actually rather stupid of the BATFE aince the premise of the ban is the use of the ammo in Pistols. Why is this stupid? It is already Illegal to use armor piercing ammo in Pistols. So why do they need ti ban an ammo on the premise it will already be used in an illegal manner? Why not just simply put a Surgeon Generalesque warning on boxes stating it is illegal to use this and all armor piercing ammo in Pistols?
The ban is on hold.
I heard the ban is no more.
http://www.wnd.com/2015/03/atf-kills-ar-15-ammo-ban/ (http://www.wnd.com/2015/03/atf-kills-ar-15-ammo-ban/)
it is on hold, they got caught trying to push the time table before the respondent deadline
QuoteNOTICE TO THOSE COMMENTING ON THE ARMOR PIERCING AMMUNITION EXEMPTION FRAMEWORK
Thank you for your interest in ATF's proposed framework for determining whether certain projectiles are "primarily intended for sporting purposes" within the meaning of 18 U.S.C. 921(a)(17)(C). The informal comment period will close on Monday, March 16, 2015. ATF has already received more than 80,000 comments, which will be made publicly available as soon as practicable.
Although ATF endeavored to create a proposal that reflected a good faith interpretation of the law and balanced the interests of law enforcement, industry, and sportsmen, the vast majority of the comments received to date are critical of the framework, and include issues that deserve further study. Accordingly, ATF will not at this time seek to issue a final framework. After the close of the comment period, ATF will process the comments received, further evaluate the issues raised therein, and provide additional open and transparent process (for example, through additional proposals and opportunities for comment) before proceeding with any framework.
congress got involved, and one is pushing for disbanding atf using this as an example of how they costantly abuse thier authority
Quote from: rw on March 12 2015 03:37:33 PM MDT
congress got involved, and one is pushing for disbanding atf using this as an example of how they costantly abuse thier authority
I heard the FBI would step in to take over... Can't think that would work out too good for us. :o
the National firearms Act of 1934 that started the disarming of citizens, was enacted only months after the alcohol Prohibition was repealed. J. Edger Hoover must have been drinking too much after all those citizens he had killed
Worse yet-
http://bearingarms.com/atf-chief-suggests-5-56-ammo-threat-law-enforcement/
The real question here is what is a "pistol" round and what is a "rifle" round.
What is causing the consternation here is the lack of sense the '34 NFA and 68 GCA make. In order to get around the short barreled rifle restrictions in the 34 NFA, people are building "Pistols" by leaving the butt stock off a rifle.
At present there are no federal classifications of ammunition as either pistol or rifle, but there are restrictions and rules attached to the missing classifications. This leads to a schrodinger-esque situation where ammunition has to manufactured according to guidelines that don't become fixed until it is fired in either a rifle or a handgun.
The result is M855 is clearly legal when used in an AR-15 stye rifle, as the round is rifle ammunition. But what about when the AR is build up with a 12" barrel and a pistol buffer assembly? Does that then re-classify the ammunition as pistol ammo? This smacks of the sig brace issue....Ammo is illegal based on how you shoot it.
This core oversight needs to be addressed. The best course of action would be to just abolish the law outright, as any other mechanism I head down ends up in some convoluted craziness.
The reality that is being revealed here is that all the laws are utter nonsense. And the sig brace ruling makes it most clear.
Having things should not be illegal. Doing things should be illegal if it results in death or injury or presents an imminent and unmanaged probability of death or injury.
Kind of like having a NUKE! You have it, but they promise not to use it! or not use it on this place or that place! :o
The U.S. has NUKEs, but they don't like it when others have them...
(as posted above, below quote taken from this link http://bearingarms.com/atf-chief-suggests-5-56-ammo-threat-law-enforcement/)
QuoteThe proper answer to the ATF's gross overreach is to completely do away with the "sporting purposes" test in the Gun Control Act of 1968, and used on a whim by the ATF in other decisions since. It is an absurd position that firearms and ammunition must have a "sporting purpose" for hunters or target shooters to be lawful.
Sadly, many feel that the .223/5.56 is a poor Deer hunting round, and therefore it is a poor hunting round. What those individuals fail to see is that there are more animals out there to hunt than just Deer. They do not realize that the .223/5.56 is one of the most popular Varmint rounds out there, and that yes, having a 30 round magazine on a semi auto platform makes it vastly easier to clear a cow pasture of prairie dogs than a bolt action. Especially when you are alone. They are not aware that a P-Dog family can number in triple digits for one Cow pasture and in those numbers are an extreme danger to the cattle that supplies the cheeseburgers they keep feeding their cats...
Clearly you don't get it. It isn't about facts...it is about how we feel.
.
Heroin, Cocaine, Marijuana, and a few other drugs use to be legal. When it was, there wasn't any major crime problems associated with those drugs. When alcohol was made illegal during prohibition, crime surrounding alcohol increased. It seems that problems only arise when things are made illegal.
.
You don't have to make it legal, you can decriminalize most of it. With confiscation for those under 21.
The war on drugs is a failure.
My_old_Glock writes
QuoteHeroin, Cocaine, Marijuana, and a few other drugs use to be legal. When it was, there wasn't any major crime problems associated with those drugs. When alcohol was made illegal during prohibition, crime surrounding alcohol increased. It seems that problems only arise when things are made illegal.
Or when an overbearing Government tries to control it or the people! ::)
I know I'm stating the obvious, but I don't believe this attempted ammo ban by the ATF had anything to do with LEO safety. It was all about our agenda-driven POTUS trying to turn the AR, and rifles like them, into paper weights, since a ban failed to materialize after Sandy Hook. I've searched the internet for hours, and I've yet to find even one instance where a LEO has been shot by a pistol-varient of an AK or an AR, which is the excuse that Obama and the ATF used to justify the ban. It's definitely time for traitor Obama, and the rest of his 'transparent' administration, to get the hell out of the White House.
The libtard Dummycrats will just find some other reason that doesn't make sense to try to justify stupid laws they're trying to pass. Validity has nothing to do with it whatsoever.
Quote from: Mr. AR50 on March 14 2015 04:32:45 PM MDT
I know I'm stating the obvious, but I don't believe this attempted ammo ban by the ATF had anything to do with LEO safety. It was all about our agenda-driven POTUS trying to turn the AR, and rifles like them, into paper weights, since a ban failed to materialize after Sandy Hook....
Rec'd from Texas State Rifle Association last week:
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Half an hour ago, Congressman John Culberton (R-Harris Co) called TSRA and asked that we get the message out to our members.
The ban on green tip ammo has been repealed and it's gone for good!
Congressman Culberson chairs a committee with direct influence over BATF and was able to convince those within the agency to remove the ban. We were also told that
the ban was actually the first of several. All part of a "research project" designed to review many types of common ammunition which might be armor-piercing.
God Bless the Texas Delegation and God Bless Congressman John Culberson who remembers TSRA members sent him to Congress many years ago and took a moment to call.
And as always,
Keep the faith.
Alice Tripp
Legislative Director
TSRA
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7n6... M855... what was next? This indignant administration isn't going to let go of the failed post Sandy Hook ban attempt before they GTFO.
Quote from: Wolfie on February 16 2015 09:29:14 AM MST
The Republican House and Senate would never let this happen.
If they didn't, Obozo would just whip out another executive order to bypass them. I am surprised he hasn't done it yet, now that the whole ban seems to be DOA.