How many times do you all reload your 10mm brass? Do you "use it 'till you lose it" or have some other way of determining when to toss it? Seems like the case mouths split much sooner on my 10mm than my 9mm.
How many times do you load up max loads or close to max loads in brass? Assuming the brass visually is in good shape.
I have some starline, double tap nickel plated, and once fired Armscor and Remington UMC brass. Being cost conscious I want to get the most "bang for my buck" :P. but safety is my top priority.
One last question, how do you mark your brass to identify how many times it has been reloaded? I try to keep lots of brass segregated, but my G20 throws brass so far it is difficult to find it all before I move on to the next lot.
I buy new Starline by the thousand, and I use that for the hot loads.
I reload the second firing with 180g plated bullets at 1200fps as my general range ammo.
I load the same load after that and pack it in bulk containers and shoot that in places I don't expect to find it again, tall grass, woods, anywhere where there is old paint cans, unharvested pumpkins after the season, and anytime I say "Hey, have you shot a 10mm yet". Its my plinking stockpile and I'll still pick up the easy stuff to load the same way, but the recovery rate is not a big number.
Greg
Quote from: Species on August 19 2014 09:28:19 PM MDT
How many times do you all reload your 10mm brass? Do you "use it 'till you lose it" or have some other way of determining when to toss it? Seems like the case mouths split much sooner on my 10mm than my 9mm.
I place my brass in 4 groups.... New, fired once, fired many, and JUNK. I use those big plastic coffee jugs for sorting with the tops/front marked as stated.
New brass is use for testing and working up loads so I have a known base to work from. Fired once brass goes for the hotter loads. Fired many is used just for target range loads. JUNK brass is brass I've gotten from sources unknown or beat up ( some brass I've been given has the rim edges chewed pretty good), I will shoot these as target loads and not pick them up. Most of my are starline tho I do have some other markings which I separate and run in the target / junk groups.
When I shoot, I fire the brass I want to keep first, in stages, so any I find are keepers... after that I shoot up the junk so i don't worry about mixing up good with bad. You prob never going to find them all, but lose a few % along the way .
With target / mid range loads you should get a good number of reloads... but I check my brass several times during the process and chuck the bad when I find them.
I use them until they split.
Quote from: gandog56 on August 20 2014 07:13:51 AM MDT
I use them until they split.
:) simple !
But a good idea to watch primer pocket too.
Quote from: tommac919 on August 20 2014 07:51:54 AM MDT
Quote from: gandog56 on August 20 2014 07:13:51 AM MDT
I use them until they split.
:) simple !
But a good idea to watch primer pocket too.
What would you be looking for here? Ie what would constitute brass to toss
With the brass especially if higher impulse loads are being used you will want to inspect them for excessive bulging or "SMILES".
(http://i1086.photobucket.com/albums/j441/_The_Shadow/IMG_0891_zpsa7c394e3.jpg)
If they are "SMILED" they are trashed, if the bulging isn't too excessive they can be reconditioned using a pass-through setup. See this link for pass-through info:
http://10mm-firearms.com/reloading-10mm-ammo/pass-thru-sizing-using-lee-fcd/ (http://10mm-firearms.com/reloading-10mm-ammo/pass-thru-sizing-using-lee-fcd/)
Any splits are trash, some splits don't show untilled resizing, some partial splits don't even show on the outside...
Primer pockets can stretch out with higher impulse ammo, missing primers need a close look or repeated uses, pass-through sizing can help this to a point. If the primers slide into the pocket with no to very little resistance the brass may be beyond reuse. Before depriming you can look for leakage around the primer and pocked fit, you may find dark or sooted areas between the primer and the pocket.
Flattened Primer can stretch the pockets...
(http://i1086.photobucket.com/albums/j441/_The_Shadow/IMG_0417-1.jpg)
Missing primer fell out on a case that smiled....
(http://i1086.photobucket.com/albums/j441/_The_Shadow/IMG_0892_zps9e9115f2.jpg)
Another issue to be concerned with is work hardening of the brass. Alloys of brass are either soft or hard, Star-Line tend to be softer and more malleable because they are sold for reloading. Recently Intercooler had purchased some LAX ammo where the bullets were seated deeply, upon inspection the cases would not hold the bullets, even after pass-through and resizing. The case was too stiff/brittle and sprang back open even after the sizing, thus bullets would just slide in or out.
I took those cases and annealed them in flame to soften the barss, then quenched them. The annealing process is used to maintain the proper softness and flexibility of the brass to keep them from splitting/cracking as they are being worked in the formation process.
Here is the pull-down of those rounds and before and after annealing measurments...
http://10mm-firearms.com/factory-10mm-ammo-pull-downs/lax-180gr-fmj-plated-(ic-51714)-pull-down/ (http://10mm-firearms.com/factory-10mm-ammo-pull-downs/lax-180gr-fmj-plated-(ic-51714)-pull-down/)
great pics Shadow...
One of the things you'll find with normal glock brass is the slight bulge near the base of the case... If not to excess ( not talking smiles ) most of my cases go thru the standard resizer and will drop freely in a max case gauge ( great tool to have btw ).
Some now and then like from the hot loads ( Buff Bore, DT, etc ) don't slide in completely. These bulged cases can be saved only by the full resizer (as mentioned)... When I have cases from hot loads I usu deprime/resize and check in the gauge before going any further. If they don't go, I place them aside for another check and separate handling.
I rarely (As like in NEVER) load them to max. Hard on the cases, hard on the pistol, and never the most accurate. All my pistols are fully supported chambers which mean no smilies. (As Glocks are notorious for)
Has anyone ever tried to do the pass through sizing on loaded rounds? You are essentially doing it with the FCD, but not hitting the base of the case. I already have several hundred cases preped with necks flared and ready to be loaded. Would like to run them through the pass through sizing process, but don't want to waste all my effort thus far.
I have tested using the LEE FCD with the guts removed as a Pass through die on finished rounds, yes it will work...However I have found it to reduce the bullet size slightly especially on cast bullets. This is not conducive to having properly sized bullets.
After pass through sizing some bullets would be looser fit, able to spin as seat inside the casing. Pulling the rounds down, showed the diameter of the bullet to be slightly smaller. :-[
These conditions can lead to poor ignition properties and leading of the bore... ???
I use the FCD on all my loads, never had neck tension issues. But I shoot mostly jacketed bullets (precision delta). My
Question was more if running a loaded round through a pass through sizer would cause any issues with primers.
Thanks for all the responses. This forum is great!
Quote from: The_Shadow on August 20 2014 06:53:30 PM MDT
I have tested using the LEE FCD with the guts removed as a Pass through die on finished rounds, yes it will work...However I have found it to reduce the bullet size slightly especially on cast bullets. This is not conducive to having properly sized bullets.
After pass through sizing some bullets would be looser fit, able to spin as seat inside the casing. Pulling the rounds down, showed the diameter of the bullet to be slightly smaller. :-[
These conditions can lead to poor ignition properties and leading of the bore... ???
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I do the bulge busting BEFORE i reload them, not after.
gandog56, I too run all my brass through the Pass-through process before running them in the sizing/decapping die.
Some use the LEE FCD as a loaded round final crimp die, I don't use mine that way.
Anyone have any issues with the Armscor 10mm brass and reloading it with warm loads? I just read Geeman's story about the Kaboom and PPU brass and now I am freaked out. :o Don't want to be posting another Kaboom story. The factory loaded armscor 10mm has been great to shoot. Loads well, is very accurate, and the price is right at about $20 per box. I split a case with a co-worker to save on shipping and it ended up being a steal, so I won't be upset if I can only use the brass for light range loads. Just curious if anyone has had reloading experience with Armscor brass. Does anyone know who makes their brass? Seems like Starline makes brass for alot of companies.....
I do have a KKM barrel and 22 and 24 pound wolff springs in my G20, so hopefully that will eliminate alot of possible factors, but in Geeman's case it seems like it was the brass and not so much the gun.
I have read a report of severely busted Amrscor cases, if I recall being shot from a Delta Elite...Not sure if they were factory or handloaded. I have reused some armscor brass, without incident, but with thorough inspections before loading. PPU brass has been documented many times with failures and poor reloading properties.
Yes, Star Line makes brass for many companies to their specifications, for the right money they will make some for you with your own headstamp, I actually inquired about getting 9x25Dillon made. The Star Line brass tends to be softer as made for handloaders, where work hardening over time can cause splits.
I haven't got any Armscor brass for 10mm.
Probably because I haven't bought any new 10mm in years. My only two exemptions were a box of Underwood to see if the claims were good, and a box of Ted Nugent just because he's so cool and I wanted some brass with his name on it.
I've been wondering the same thing. I know there are several variables, but how many loadings can one reasonably expect from new Starline brass before it splits?
If you were reloading the Star-Line brass with slower powders like Blue Dot, AA#9 with reasonable charges, it may last you 10 to 12 plus loading. Using full charges of faster powders can cause faster failure rates and work hardening.
If you push to the heavier loadings, you can expect work hardening or if you have lack of chamber support or unlock early you can see badly bulged or even smiled casings. ???
Just too many factors to tell you a definitive number. What pistol is shooting it, what weight bullets, what pressure and velocity you running the ammo at? What brass you using? I expect 7-8 good reloadings. More than 10 wouldn't surprise me.
Just received my shipping notification on Friday. Should have it on Tuesday ;D
Now I just need some more powder.
Powder has been hard to find since Obozo got elected.