I'm new to 10mm reloading. I have some Starline once fired brass from a guy and some has light Glock smiles. It came from full powered PBR brand loads in a recently manufactured stock Glock barrel.
1. Do smiles appear at max normal Saami pressure loads or at mid-range loads? That is, at what pressure point do you start to see smiles?
2. Okay to use my Bulge Buster on smiled brass and reload moderate and light loads?
I'm trying to decide if I must order a KKM barrel or can use the factory Glock barrel as long as I don't shoot max pressure loads.
Thanks!
Here's some pictures of the brass. Parabellum Research 200 gr JHP ammo in Starline cases. Looks to be a stout load. Shot out of a stock G20SF made in the last year. I have the brass and ended up trading for the guys G20.
My main concern is whether I need to buy a KKM barrel. I don't plan to shoot max loads and don't want to ruin scarce 10mm brass.
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10mm-Admirer, First welcome to the forum! However I will have to advise you that those brass are ruined! Any brass that has a "SMILE" or "FROWN" exactly like those you have pictured are not safe to reuse even with the bulge Buster or Redding GRX pass-through dies.
Why do I say that? Those distinct lines are where the brass has started to shear on the molecular level and the pass-through process can not restore that to be safe again. The pass-thru is useable for smooth rounded bulges, to squeeze that area back to restore the shape of the brass casing to allow it to fit proper dimensions like a case gauge. See this link;http://10mm-firearms.com/reloading-10mm-ammo/pass-thru-sizing-using-lee-fcd/ (http://10mm-firearms.com/reloading-10mm-ammo/pass-thru-sizing-using-lee-fcd/)
The KKM barrel can help with better tolerances of the chamber, but if the Glock barrel is held properly in lockup for a the ejection cycle then you may not see "SMILES" from the factory barrel, providing the ammo is not excessive pressure.
I just ran 50 of the PBR rounds through my factory barrel with no "SMILES" on any of the cases, this was from G-20 SF with factory recoil spring for 25 rounds and the Wolff 22lb spring on the Wolff non-captive recoil rod.
Details of that load are listed in the 10mm pull-down section.
Please reconsider your trying to reuse the "SMILED" brass, if they are back in alignment with the feed ramp and of significant pressure you could experience a case blowout. That is a very dangerous situation and it can damage your gun and quite possibly injure yourself or someone else. :o
Thank you for the advice and information. I will not use the smiling cases.
I wonder why the pistol produced the smiles? Stock barrel and recoil spring. Only 50 rounds through the new pistol when fired.
Not sure what velocity or pressure they were generating, how ever pulling them down to see what is inside may show what powder and how much was loaded. We did several pull-downs of the PBR ammo with some fairly recently in the last week. I personally tested it in my G-20SF and no "SMILES" from mine you can read about the test results here.
http://10mm-firearms.com/factory-10mm-ammo-pull-downs/parabellum-research-pbr-v-supreme-165gr-fmj-(from-chucky2)/ (http://10mm-firearms.com/factory-10mm-ammo-pull-downs/parabellum-research-pbr-v-supreme-165gr-fmj-(from-chucky2)/)
I actually had looked over every fired casing looking for any smiles and issues, then again as I pass through sized them, and then regular sizing and depriming. I am anal when it comes to loading and shooting and if you read of some of my pull-downs it will show what I do, I load every round like my life depended on it! :D
I put all the 10mm brass in question in the scrap bucket. Sigh. Hard to let it go. It is hard and expensive to find 10mm brass right now.
Great advice from The Shadow. That ammo is not suitable for your gun. This shows how differently things run in different guns -- even when all variables are supposedly identical.
As far as pressure, none of us know what the pressure is in our factory ammo nor handloads when shot in the gun. The component manufacturers know what the pressures were in their test barrel, in their lab conditions, with their specific lots of components. We have to settle for clues that we've pushed things too far because our variables are all slightly different.
My Gen 3 G20 is fortunately one that seems to be able to take some hotter loads without inducing smiles. I have only ever seen smiles once. That was a hand loaded 180 gr XTP over 800-X workup. I have taken all of the major performing powders (except VV) for 10mm and pushed to max or a little beyond. Also, hot factory like a BB 180 @ 1335 doesn't smile in my gun either.
So here is the rub... Ammo is very gun specific. That ammo is not right for your gun. I'd be inclined to trade the remaining lot, send back to the mfg, or pull down for components. You can salvage brass, bullet and primer, but not the powder. If you do that, remove the de-capping pin from your sizer and re-size the case with the primer still in. I certainly wouldn't shoot more of it.
When we seek the top end, whether it is groups or velocities (or both), the particular guns start to reveal their characters. Every day blasting ammo isn't going to be as fussy. It is when we try to fine-tune things that an individual gun's quirks are revealed. And I do see carefully working up to top velocities as a fine-tuning operation to be approached with extreme diligence.