As I am gathering parts and compontents to start reloading, I've decided to try the wet tumbling/stainless steel pin method so I built a tumbler drum from 6 inch pvc and have a barrel turner to spin it. While waiting for the Pins to get here I got anxious and bought some walnut shells from the pet store to try the thing out running it with dry media.
The drum is 6inch od pvc x 24inch long with two trips attached to inside to agitate, cap on one end, 6inch to 4inch reducer on the other with a rubber temporary cap to seal it. I'm sure some of you have seen identical designs online. My barrel turner is heavy duty, the guy I bought it from said it was used to spin barrels full of spray on truck bed liner so it can spin some weight. Motor is a chain drive Dayton 1/4hp 4.6amp rolling 40rpm. I figured this should be adequate speed, maybe a tad slow.
My question is this; when you guys use the vibratory bowl type cleaners with walnut shells, what's the ratio of walnut shells to brass? Also how long do you run it? Any suggestions to improve with walnut? I used coffee jugs to try and measure a ratio, filled one up all the way with walnut, and another jug up 2/3 way up with cases. Gave me ~550 mixed 10mm,40sw,.357 and 25 or so rifle cases and when both were poured in tumbler barrel it filled it up about 1/3 of the way. I ran my set up for 3.5hrs and The handgun brass I put in it cleaned up pretty good so far but it has not done much for the rifle cases, Pic attached.
I know this is not the traditional method of using walnut shells but I figured tumblers will tumble and clean no matter whats in it so why not?
[attachment deleted by admin]
Pic of drum and turner set up.
[attachment deleted by admin]
Walnut cleans faster than corn cob, but corn cob puts on a higher luster shine.
But I use a wet rotary tumbler with stainless steel media to get them sparkling clean! I mean look at these, especially the primer cups.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v196/Gandog56/270brass_zps25bd712e.jpg)
Thanks for the heads up. I didn't really know how long it would take, figured it'd be a while with the dry media. Maybe I need more walnut in the mix to increase the efficiency? Faster turning?
Those cases look fantastic! You're right, the way they cleans the insides and primer pockets is top notch. I cannot wait for my pins. I'm just hoping 5lb will be enough considering the volume of my drum. What size drum do you use and what ratio water/pins/cases? Also, how fast does yours roll? Most I see are the 1gallon water (8lb) 5lbs pins 2lbs or so brass with a dash of the lemishine and dish soap, usually fills up most tumblers, run between 40-60rpm I believe.
I use corn cob in a vibrating tumbler, I add about a tablespoon of charcoal lighter fluid to the media, prior to placing the brass, let it run a while to evenly distribute. Then add the brass and a few (8 - 10) cut 1" squares of Blue Scott Shop towel.
The lighter fluid helps cut the crud, the pieces of towel gathers up the fine dust. Media stays cleaner longer. :D
Some badly tarnished brass doesn't may not come totally clean no matter what! :(
I use walnut first on badly tarnished brass. I give them 1 to 3 hours and then put them in corncob to finish up.
I use a little of Midway's polish and add some small squares for Dryer Sheets. It takes the static out of the corn cob and collects dirt.
Shadow I remember you saying about the lighter fluid, I got a little excited and forgot to give it a try! I can see how it would probably put a hurtin on some tarnish. I'd like to see that .50 case get clean, I'm not sure where its from but It was given to me by my grandfather so its hard to tell, know it' s old. I also now see why you guys use the dryer sheets/shop towels, i never realized how much of a dusty mess the stuff can be! How long does Walnut media usually last anyhow?
I like the idea of the polish BEEMER!, Think if I tossed in a tiny bit of some paste car wax or couple strands of Never dull it would have the same effect?
I quit using the dryer sheets, one that wasn't used, got mixed in and really fouled things up, causing the media and debris to stick to some of the brass casings.
The polish is nice, but can clog the media a little bit. Polish is great for those long term storage rounds!
I put the polish on the dryer towels and "mush" it in with my fingers. Then I add them one at a time and let them go for about 5 minutes until the corn cob gets to rolling good before putting in the brass.
I have not used anything else besides the Midway polish so I do not know. Brasso has ammonia in it so don't use it.
Quote from: BT8850 on February 20 2014 09:37:05 AM MST
Shadow I remember you saying about the lighter fluid, I got a little excited and forgot to give it a try! I can see how it would probably put a hurtin on some tarnish.
Once again, wet rotary with stainless steel. Here's some before after pick of some badly tarnished stuff it did.
Before
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v196/Gandog56/SANY0096_zpsb01142de.jpg)
After
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v196/Gandog56/SANY0097_zps853f0655.jpg)
I like your home brewed Tumbler there BT
I've been using Walnut to clean and Corn to polish for ever
Works well enough
I can go wet if I'd like
Here's my set-up:
(http://i1108.photobucket.com/albums/h414/denstinettm14/Shop%20and%20Reloading/ThreeCanBrassTumbler.jpg)
I use ultrasonic (cheapo Harbor Freight one) and the fluid is one cup white vinegar, four cups hot water, and a drizzle of dawn dishwashing soap. It isn't as shiny as your results, but that's just fine by me.
Greg
Quote from: BEEMER! on February 20 2014 10:15:09 AM MST
I put the polish on the dryer towels and "mush" it in with my fingers. Then I add them one at a time and let them go for about 5 minutes until the corn cob gets to rolling good before putting in the brass.
I have not used anything else besides the Midway polish so I do not know. Brasso has ammonia in it so don't use it.
Alright, thanks for the heads up, I'll have to give this a try, i'm a bit of a shine junky :o
Quote from: gandog56 on February 20 2014 03:46:22 PM MST
Once again, wet rotary with stainless steel. Here's some before after pick of some badly tarnished stuff it did.
Before
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v196/Gandog56/SANY0096_zpsb01142de.jpg)
After
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v196/Gandog56/SANY0097_zps853f0655.jpg)
You have to stop i'm getting super antsy for my pins looking at these pics LOL once again those look fantastic! It's pretty impressive what the pins can do. What size tumbler/what rpm do you run?
Quote from: DenStinett on February 20 2014 04:33:45 PM MST
I like your home brewed Tumbler there BT
I've been using Walnut to clean and Corn to polish for ever
Works well enough
I can go wet if I'd like
Here's my set-up:
(http://i1108.photobucket.com/albums/h414/denstinettm14/Shop%20and%20Reloading/ThreeCanBrassTumbler.jpg)
Thanks! I bought the barrel turner off of a guy on craigslist for 100 bucks and have about 30 in the drum and 15 for the walnut, probably another 45 or so for pins. Its a little salty but for ~200 I have a set up that will hopefully wet tumble ~900-1000 10mm cases at a time. Do I need it? Not really but why not :P Yours looks like a pretty sweet set up, a fellow home brewer! I like that it's a bench top unit. I'm thinking I'm going to modify mine to more easily store, it's taking up floor space and its also not level to the drum walks. What motor and RPM do you run with your walnut/corn cob?
Quote from: Geeman on February 20 2014 05:29:59 PM MST
I use ultrasonic (cheapo Harbor Freight one) and the fluid is one cup white vinegar, four cups hot water, and a drizzle of dawn dishwashing soap. It isn't as shiny as your results, but that's just fine by me.
Greg
Hey man if it works it works!!
Also, on a side note. I stopped after work yesterday and picked up a container to put my unused bag of media into. Got home all excited to be organized and cleaned up, rushed up stairs to get the tumbler rolling and put the fresh media away. Attached is a picture of what I found, as well as the culprit. Moral of the story, don't zip tie closed your 90% full bag of walnut shells and leave it in a room where your dog can push the door open! I was able to salvage most of it, the shopvac got the rest :(
[attachment deleted by admin]
Quote from: BT8850 on February 21 2014 09:15:53 AM MST
Yours looks like a pretty sweet set up, a fellow home brewer! I like that it's a bench top unit. I'm thinking I'm going to modify mine to more easily store, it's taking up floor space and its also not level to the drum walks. What motor and RPM do you run with your walnut/corn cob?
Thank you
Could tell you the motor, the whole thing is surplus parts
All I know is, it's a Pump Motor
I could count the RPMs but have never even thought about it
Yeah, If this one get a little off Bubble, the Cans walk too
I've been using a 50/50 mix of cob/walnut shells for quite a few years now, no additive. Its a old Midway vibrator style, I don't think they sell this big one any more. Works good. I run the bowl half full of media and can run 500 10mm or 300 Win 284 cases at a time. I let run for at least 3-4 hrs per batch. Not quite as bright as the liquid/pins method but works for me.
Dennis
Quote from: BT8850 on February 21 2014 09:22:05 AM MST
Also, on a side note. I stopped after work yesterday and picked up a container to put my unused bag of media into. Got home all excited to be organized and cleaned up, rushed up stairs to get the tumbler rolling and put the fresh media away. Attached is a picture of what I found, as well as the culprit. Moral of the story, don't zip tie closed your 90% full bag of walnut shells and leave it in a room where your dog can push the door open! I was able to salvage most of it, the shopvac got the rest :(
All I can say is.....
NICE ! ! !
Quote from: denclaste on February 21 2014 12:23:07 PM MST
I've been using a 50/50 mix of cob/walnut shells for quite a few years now, no additive. Its a old Midway vibrator style, I don't think they sell this big one any more. Works good. I run the bowl half full of media and can run 500 10mm or 300 Win 284 cases at a time. I let run for at least 3-4 hrs per batch. Not quite as bright as the liquid/pins method but works for me.
Dennis
Very cool
That's what I like about my 3 Can set-up
I can run three different sizes of Brass at once
One can with, let's say, 9mm or 38/357s (300+)
One with 10mm (250ish)
And another with 308s (150 or so)
I run them thru the Walnut for a few hours to get them clean, and then into the Corn for a few (or overnight) to get them good and polished
I'll size my 308s than run them thru the Corn once more for a couple hours to get the Sizing Lube off
Straight Walled stuff goes right from the Corn to the Sizer and on thru the reloading process
Quote from: DenStinett on February 21 2014 02:22:34 PM MST
All I can say is.....
NICE ! ! !
Yea a nice big mess! I could have killed him >:D
Quote from: DenStinett on February 21 2014 02:33:42 PM MST
Quote from: denclaste on February 21 2014 12:23:07 PM MST
I've been using a 50/50 mix of cob/walnut shells for quite a few years now, no additive. Its a old Midway vibrator style, I don't think they sell this big one any more. Works good. I run the bowl half full of media and can run 500 10mm or 300 Win 284 cases at a time. I let run for at least 3-4 hrs per batch. Not quite as bright as the liquid/pins method but works for me.
Dennis
Very cool
That's what I like about my 3 Can set-up
I can run three different sizes of Brass at once
One can with, let's say, 9mm or 38/357s (300+)
One with 10mm (250ish)
And another with 308s (150 or so)
I run them thru the Walnut for a few hours to get them clean, and then into the Corn for a few (or overnight) to get them good and polished
I'll size my 308s than run them thru the Corn once more for a couple hours to get the Sizing Lube off
Straight Walled stuff goes right from the Corn to the Sizer and on thru the reloading process
That separation would be nice, sure beats sifting through them all! What sort of agitators do you have on the inside of your cans?
Also, what do you guys use for a media separator? One can easily go about buying one but in the nature of homebrewing, I'm thinking of making one on the cheap!
Quote from: BT8850 on February 23 2014 01:14:07 PM MST
That separation would be nice, sure beats sifting through them all! What sort of agitators do you have on the inside of your cans?
It's a pump Motor running the V'Belt, the Belt runs the two Rollers
The Rollers are held to the 2x4s with Sockets and Pipestrap
Quote from: BT8850 on February 23 2014 01:14:07 PM MST
Also, what do you guys use for a media separator? One can easily go about buying one but in the nature of homebrewing, I'm thinking of making one on the cheap!
I use a Midway Crank Sifter now.....
BUT, I use to use my Homegrown Sifter
It was a Gallon Tupperware Container that I cut the bottom off of
Then took an 8"x8" piece if ΒΌ" Chicken Wire and melted that into the bottom of the Container, then cut off the excess CW
I'd set the Sifter in my Media Bucket, dump the Paint Can full of Media and Brass into it, snap on the Lid and shake all the Media out of the thing
Worked great
I use a cat scooper to pull my brass out of the vibrator - worked great in the cat box - works great in the vibrator, little shake and the media fall out of the shells and the shells go straight to the full sizer for treatment. I did buy a new scooper for the shells.
Doug
Thanks for the input fellas. I like the set up for the sifter DenStinett, I think I'll stop buy the dollar store and see about some containers to mutilate 8) I will update when it comes to fruition
I use a cement mixer filled with a big bag of Lizard Litter (crushed walnut) from Petsmart. Then I pour in a 50/50 mixture of odorless mineral spirits and Nufinish car wax. Toss in a couple used dryer sheet and let it run for about 45 minutes. It will look like factory finish.
I always thought to use my Gallon Paint Can and a Paint Mixer
A Two Can Rig would be cool too
Quote from: us_shooter on February 25 2014 05:52:36 PM MST
I use a cement mixer filled with a big bag of Lizard Litter (crushed walnut) from Petsmart. Then I pour in a 50/50 mixture of odorless mineral spirits and Nufinish car wax. Toss in a couple used dryer sheet and let it run for about 45 minutes. It will look like factory finish.
Nice. The lizard litter is the same stuff I bought, it was 17 bucks and some change for the biggest bag they had, probably 25lbs or so. I thought my motor was heavy duty but I believe a cement mixer takes the cake! You mix the spirits and wax in with the brass and walnut and run it (I feel ike this would make sort of a slurry, aka mess) or do you remove the walnut and then run the brass with spirits/wax? I know you said mixture is 50/50, how much is the mineral spirits volume wise?
Quote from: DenStinett on February 25 2014 09:12:03 PM MST
I always thought to use my Gallon Paint Can and a Paint Mixer
A Two Can Rig would be cool too
That would be pretty neat, wonder if I could avoid all this 'build your own tumbler' stuff and just go to lowes with paint cans full of brass and walnut shells and have them shake em on their mixers while I shop LOL :)) If you have your own mixer that would be an interesting project.
Here we go
I'll take the bottom one
Two at a time, with a 60 min timer
Shake and we're on to the next step....
http://www.mayerpaint.com/pacer_15.htm
Quote from: DenStinett on February 26 2014 10:20:19 AM MST
Here we go
I'll take the bottom one
Two at a time, with a 60 min timer
Shake and we're on to the next step....
http://www.mayerpaint.com/pacer_15.htm
That's what I call efficiency! Think those babies wouldn't come out sparkling 8) I was actually at Lowes this evening and as I walked by the paint section I had to shake my head and laugh to myself at the Idea of asking the kid running the mixers if he could throw on a bucket full of 10mm cases HAHA
I'd definitely try it before I even bought a used / basket-case
At the rate they shake, I wonder if an hour would be enough or too much ?
I tumble twice . The first is corncob , then I size , and decap , and then I wet tumble with stainless pins .
Sorry I don't have any pics .
Quote from: Tomcat 10 on February 26 2014 07:07:31 PM MST
I tumble twice . The first is corncob , then I size , and decap , and then I wet tumble with stainless pins .
Sorry I don't have any pics .
Try DeCapping first and you'll get your Primer Pocket cleaned too
Quote from: DenStinett on February 26 2014 07:24:19 PM MST
Quote from: Tomcat 10 on February 26 2014 07:07:31 PM MST
I tumble twice . The first is corncob , then I size , and decap , and then I wet tumble with stainless pins .
Sorry I don't have any pics .
Try DeCapping first and you'll get your Primer Pocket cleaned too
Not with a vibratory tumbler you wont. Which is why I went to a wet rotary one.
Quote from: gandog56 link=topic=2414.msg27549#msg27549
Not with a vibratory tumbler you wont. Which is why I went to a wet rotary one.
Hey Dog:
They may not get polished, but the Primer Residue is cleaned out and the Pockets are clean enough to receive new Primers
And when it comes to the Prime Pocket, that's all I'm interested in
No one sees the inside of the Primer Pocket but me, and the new Primer !
Quote from: DenStinett on February 27 2014 01:40:33 PM MST
Quote from: gandog56 link=topic=2414.msg27549#msg27549 Not with a vibratory tumbler you wont. Which is why I went to a wet rotary one.
/quote]
Hey Dog:
They may not get polished, but the Primer Residue is cleaned out and the Pockets are clean enough to receive new Primers
And when it comes to the Prime Pocket, that's all I'm interested in
No one sees the inside of the Primer Pocket but me, and the new Primer !
You mean a sonic cleaner will get the primer pockets THIS clean?
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v196/Gandog56/SANY0162_zpsc4a0d1af.jpg)
Quote from: gandog56 on February 27 2014 04:52:55 PM MST
Quote from: DenStinett on February 27 2014 01:40:33 PM MST
Quote from: gandog56 link=topic=2414.msg27549#msg27549 Not with a vibratory tumbler you wont. Which is why I went to a wet rotary one.
/quote]
Hey Dog:
They may not get polished, but the Primer Residue is cleaned out and the Pockets are clean enough to receive new Primers
And when it comes to the Prime Pocket, that's all I'm interested in
No one sees the inside of the Primer Pocket but me, and the new Primer !
You mean a sonic cleaner will get the primer pockets THIS clean?
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v196/Gandog56/SANY0162_zpsc4a0d1af.jpg)
NO, I never said I get the Pocket THAT clean
In my humble opinion, that isn't clean, that's polished my friend
My Tumbler gets the Primer Pocket cleaned-out, no Residue
As clean a any hand held Pocket Brush gets them
BUT, with my set-up, I can go wet too, if I'd like
Would have to disagree a bit there. It's cleaned AND polished. Not a trace of carbon in the primer cup or inside the case. I mean a regular vibratoryy will clean them pockets out good enough to prime them.
But I'm a bit anal, I guess! ;D
I don't have Carbon at all after I run them through my dry set-up
But yes, your Liquid set-up does get rid of the tarnish on the inside of both the Case and the Primer Pocket too
Places no one sees after the Round is loaded
Quote from: BT8850 on February 26 2014 05:49:21 AM MST
Quote from: us_shooter on February 25 2014 05:52:36 PM MST
I use a cement mixer filled with a big bag of Lizard Litter (crushed walnut) from Petsmart. Then I pour in a 50/50 mixture of odorless mineral spirits and Nufinish car wax. Toss in a couple used dryer sheet and let it run for about 45 minutes. It will look like factory finish.
Nice. The lizard litter is the same stuff I bought, it was 17 bucks and some change for the biggest bag they had, probably 25lbs or so. I thought my motor was heavy duty but I believe a cement mixer takes the cake! You mix the spirits and wax in with the brass and walnut and run it (I feel ike this would make sort of a slurry, aka mess) or do you remove the walnut and then run the brass with spirits/wax? I know you said mixture is 50/50, how much is the mineral spirits volume wise?
Guess I need to explain a little better.
I open a new bottle of NUFINISH wax and pour half of it into another container to save till later.
Then I top off the now half bottle of NUFINISH with odorless mineral spirits, shake well.
Turn on the mixer with 25 lbs of lizard litter in it and gradually add the 50/50 wax mixture.
Obviously when you first pour in the wax it will clump a little but will quickly go away.
Now add about a 5 gallon bucket of dirty brass and let it run till shiny.
FWIW I took the steel paddles out of the mixer and made some out of kydex.
Quote from: us_shooter on February 27 2014 08:54:16 PM MST
Guess I need to explain a little better.
I open a new bottle of NUFINISH wax and pour half of it into another container to save till later.
Then I top off the now half bottle of NUFINISH with odorless mineral spirits, shake well.
Turn on the mixer with 25 lbs of lizard litter in it and gradually add the 50/50 wax mixture.
Obviously when you first pour in the wax it will clump a little but will quickly go away.
Now add about a 5 gallon bucket of dirty brass and let it run till shiny.
FWIW I took the steel paddles out of the mixer and made some out of kydex.
Alright that makes more sense, I apologize for the confusion! Ill have to give it a try, seems to be common with everyone here that dry tumbles, using some sort of wax/polishing concoction along with dryer sheets. Good call on the kydex, I've got a bunch left over from holser projects, never would have thought to use it!