So....
Has anyone here done any home parkerizing? I have been reading about it for about two years and finally ordered some park solution today. LCW Manganese Phosphate solution on Amazon for $35/gallon. Should be here in about a week.
Plan is to make my first go on my full size Witness. I have never been a fan of the Wonder finish. It now has a couple spots where it surface rusted and I had to polish the rust back out. So, I will detail strip, degrease with brake cleaner the slide and frame, drop them in boiling water for about 15 minutes, glove up and retrieve. Once cool I will sandblast them. I like pretty agressive texture on the gun, but I haven't decided yet on bead or sand and what grit. I will probably start with bead to remove the old finish, then tape off roll marks and hit it with a more aggressive sand blast and see what I get. Comments very welcome on this step.
Once blasted, degrease again and back in the fresh boiling water. Then into the park tank at 180
I've home parkerized several rifles. Sounds like you've got a good plan, just make sure to degrease the parts really well. I've had the best luck with 80 grit sand blasting.
What are you using for a tank? Stainless is recommended, expensive for a rifle but for a pistol, a large stainless cooking pot should work fine. I found it does leave some permanent residue on the bottom of the pot though (in the hot spots from the burner) so don't use your wife's good pots.
Here's a custom Mauser 98 in 338-06 that I built and parkerized a few years ago. The parkerizing was a very dark grey, almost black, under natural light.
(http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c26/zthang43/Bang/Mauser%20338-06%20AI/Mauser338-06AI011.jpg)
(http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c26/zthang43/Bang/Mauser%20338-06%20AI/Mauser338-06AI003.jpg)
Very nice.
I have to options for the park pot. I have a large stainless stock pot we send with children who have upset stomach's...the "barf bucket". Or I have an enamel stock pot. I was going to park in the enamel and boil in the stainless as we do cook soup in it from time to time.
My house is a little different. I do 90% of the cooking, so they are technically my pots:-). My wife makes great candies and treats, but meals is not her forte.
I plan on doing some sand/bead blasting this weekend, and will post some pics with updates as I go. Park solution won't be here for 7-10 days, so I won't get to that until the weekend of the 28th most likely.
I picked up a spot sand/bead blaster at harbor freight today, as well as 25 lbs of 70 grit AO media. I detail stripped the slide, scrubbed it well with dawn and hot water, then degressed with oven cleaner, then more scrubbing. Headed out and started learning (doing stupid things)
My initial idea was to bead blast to remove the "Wonder" finish. I don't know if the bead blasting was working, but I could not tell any change, so I switched to the Aluminum Oxide media. That definitely did the trick, although there isn't a huge difference in color between the wonder finish and white steel.
I also ran my first few oz of blast media while standing on the top step of my rear deck. Facing out towards the yard. Wearing clothes I hoped to wear the rest of the day. Nope, nope,nope. Blast media all over the back deck, all over me, all over everything. For the second tank of media, I went into the middle of the grass in my back yard.
It took about 5 lbs of media to get to this:
(http://fellingfamily.net/images/witness_slide.jpg)
At this point I had to knock off to shower and get ready for date night with the Mrs. So, I re-scrubbed it, then degreased again, and inspected.
I have also learned I need to take my grease avoidance to a whole new level. Not sure what that is yet, but I kept getting little smears of grease on the slide. I have to think about that one a bit.
Another hour of prep though and I expect this to be put in the tank.
Have you tried baking soda as a blasting agent? Not real agressive can clean but with a soft satin finish.
I haven't. I do want an agressive texture, but I will give it a try on my stainless 1911.
My only experience has been with motorcycle parts...... aluminum, cast iron and steel......it usually takes some heat application to help remove all oil residue as it impregnates into the metal during heat cycles. I don't know the correct scientific term but it's there, not just on the surface. I like the results of soda blasting, especially over bead blasting but that is an individual preference. The soda medium is easily removed with simply washing with water. Soda blasting isn't very abrasive so doesn't do as well with rust or if you want an aggressive finish.
I have the Witness completely torn down at this point. All that is left in the frame of slide are a couple of roll pins I don't want to have to restart. I hope to get the frame sand blasted this afternoon. Will post pics when is done.
I'm very curious to see how it turns out.
No real update per se, but notice of a slight change of direction.
First, the too long; didn't read (TL;DR): I am going to spray with Cerakote oven cure after the park, rather than treat with oil.
Several years back when I picked up my first witness, I wasn't happy with the silver finish. I looked into Gunkote and had decided on a plan to sand blast the Wonder finish off, and refinish with Gunkote. Several sources suggested Parkerizing was a great prep surface for a good bond.
The gun held up OK and I got more used to the color of Wonder finish and this plan fell to the wayside. As this was the only handgun I had at the time it was not convenient to take it out of service for several days/weeks while I undertook the refinish.
Since then the finish has degraded and several more handguns have appeared in the safe. I had also grown found of really industrial/basic military type finishes, so I moved ahead with just parkerizing.
But I made the mistake of doing some reading and am impressed with Cerakote. So I have some on the way. Hope to wrap this all up in a marathon on Saturday.
I am going with the graphite black and hope the rougher texture on the metal will help matte out the gloss I see on some cerakote arms. And I hope the wife won't freak when I put a gun in my oven ;D.
Just checked the UPS tracking....The park solution is out for delivery, so it should be there when I get home tonight.
Last night I wired up the frame and slide and tested fit in the oven, as well as thinking through my airbrush passes.
Tonight I have to go buy a new airbrush. Can't find my old badger brush. Also a inline filter, etc. When I get home I will blast the frame, guide rod and hit a few spots on the slide I see I need to get a little better. Then I am going to load the gun with acetone and do some test sprays looking for even coats on the metal.
Tomorrow night, Dark Knight Rises, so I have to get most of my prep done today so I am ready to park and spray on Saturday.
Completed on Saturday.
It tooks some doing to assemble the final members of the tool/supply cast. The biggest issue was the filter/hose to run my airbrush from my compressor. I have a Badger 250 airbrush, but none of the local hobby/art stores that carry badger had anything but an adapter to run the brush from a CO2 can. Finally, Saturday morning, I checked Harbor Freight. Bingo. Filter, $5.00, hose $3.00. I don't know why I go anywhere else.
So, with those pieces in place I had all my supplies finally. Here is the list:
Re-usable
2 stock pots (one stainless, one enamel because that is what I had)
Candy Thermometer
1 Roasting pan (again enamel since I had one)
Full Face Mask and respirator
Quart Jar
Small scrub brush (toothrbush works great)
Sand Blaster
Air Compressor (not shown)
Airbrush (Badger 250 in my case)
Hose/filter
Graduated Cylinder (for mixing Cerakote, came with Cerakote kit)
Paint Filters (again, came with the Cerakote kit)
Fondue Fork (I needed something to reach into the graduated cylinder and stir)
Tools to disassemble guns (screwdriver, punches, mallet)
Dual burner propane heater (not shown)
Consumable
Paper towels (fresh from the wrap so they don't have ANY grease on them)
Masking tape
Nitrile gloves
Steel Wool
Magnesium Phosphate Park Solution (Duracoat brand in my case)
Blast Media (70 grit AO is what I could get, 120 is what is recommended)
Acetone
Brake Cleaner
Dish Soap/hot water
Distilled Water
Cerakote
Propane
Aliminum wire to hang the parts
(http://fellingfamily.net/images/witnessCast.jpg)
(Supporting Cast)
First Up, Tear Down
The first thing I did was detail strip my Witness. All the way. The only think I left in the frame was the slide stop retainer spring and corresponding pin. If you don't know how to do this, visit Henning's website for a great video on detail stripping your gun. Even if you don't need this help to get it apart, it is a great help when trying to get it back together.
I put all the pins, springs, small parts, etc that weren't part of this project in a zip lock bag. I actually took my gun apart about a week or more in advance. I was worried about the sandblast phase so I did it over several days leading up to this.
Finally, decide exactly what you are going to process. I did the slide, frame, barrel and guide rod. Of these, only the slide and frame were parkerized. The barrel and guide rod were sand blasted, then received Cerakote.
I also left my sights on the gun. This means my white and red dots were sand blasted out, then parkerized over and cerakoted black. That is fine for me. I will drill them out on a drill press later and re-paint them with white/glow paint.
The Prep
Prep is the most critical part if you want a good finish. Neither parkerizing or cerakoting will hide imperfections. Inspect the slide and frame for any deep scratches or defects you want removed. Sand them out before sandblasting. Surface rust the sand blasting will get. And deep pitting it won't.
Degrease the parts. I scrubbed them with soap and hot water, then rinsed really well, then hosed down with brake cleaner. From here on handle only with gloves on.
Sand blasting. I used 70 grit aluminum oxide since that is what I could find locally. Cerakoate recommends 120, but not finer. Coarser seems to be fine. The degrease is to keep media clean according to what you will read. But there is another reason I learned the hard way. Blast media sticks to any grease or oil on the target. And you will find it stuck there much later after cleaning.
Wire up the parts at this point so you have a hook on them. You will use this to place them in/fish them out of the various tanks, as well as hang them after spraying and during curing. I wired the slide by the extractor pin hole, the frame from the plunger tube/mag relase, and the barrel by the slide stop hole. The guide rod I just wrapped the wire around a few times.
Acetone bath. Once sand blasted, I blow them off with air to remove any blast media. I also got to over over all the cracks and crevices with a toothpick since I hadn't degreased enough. The parts then went into an acetone bath in the roaster. This is to chemically remove any traces of oil from the parts.
A comment about the barrel. I didn't want to coat the inside of the bore or chamber. I drove a lead slug into the muzzle to plug it, and wrapped an empty cartridge with tape and drove it into the chamber for a plug on breech.
The parkerizing solution is mixed 4:1 with clean water. My water is really hard, so I purchased distilled water for this purpose. Measure the water first. I used four quarts of water and 1 quart of concentrate. This gave me over a gallon of solution, more than enough for small parts. Place the pot on the burner over medium heat and raise them temp to 170 degrees -190 degrees F. Candy thermometer is for temp. On my burner it took about 15 minutes to reach temp, and keeping the burner on low with the lid off it would stay at 180 degrees . Once at temperature you have to temper a new mix by putting in a pad of steel wool for 15 minutes.
I put 1.5 gallons of distilled water in another stock pot with the flame on high and brought it to a rolling boil.
Once the parts have been in the acetone for at least 15 minutes I moved them to the boiling water for another 15 minutes. I checked the water perodically for any sign of oil on the surface, which would kick me back to degrease. Non was seen.
Also, don't put the barrel in this bath. I did. The air trapped inside the barrel expands as it heats and eventually blows out the breech plug.
(http://fellingfamily.net/images/witnessBoil.jpg)
The steel parts, frame and slide in my case, get moved from the boiling water to the parkerizing solution. Pre-heating them in the boiling water also helps an even parkerization because the part is already hot and their is no rebound in the tank. They fiz, alot at first. It slows down after about 3-4 minutes. The parts stay in the tank for 15 minutes total.
(http://fellingfamily.net/images/witnessParkTank.jpg)
About 5-6 minutes after immersion in park
After 15 minutes pull the parts out of the parkerizing tank, and move them back to the boiling water. This removes any remaining park solution and stops the reaction.
After 5 minutes of so in the water I moved the parts back to the acetone bath, which both gave a final chemical degrease and cooled the part to room temp, and then hung them prior to spraying. The parkerized parts had some gunk on them from the process. I think a lot of it was left over from the steel wool. I rubbed them down good with paper towels to remove this gunk.
If parkerization is the end goal, don't acetone dunk them. Keep them hot and spray with WD-40, then with the lube of your choice. The heat will help the porous parkerized surface take in the oil/grease.
(http://fellingfamily.net/images/witnessPostPark.jpg)
I mixed up 38mL of Cerakote per the instructions - 36mL of base + 2mL of hardner. This was supposed to do a pistol. I actually was spraying a frame, two slide (the stainless Para slide got in on the fun) a barrel and a guide rod. I had 22 mL left over that got tossed. But, 18+1 probably would not have left enough for the draw tube in my sprayer to work right. Next time I am going to mix 27 mL base + 1.5mL harder. That should still leave me with 6-8mL of extra, but way better than 22.
I ran several test sprays of acetone, and then some tests of the cerakote onto cardboard to get a feel. I am NOT an airbrush/spray guy unless you like runs. I am really good at runs.
The instructions for cerakote say it should look "wet" after spraying. If it looks dry then the Cerakote dried in the air before it hit and it won't stick right. It should also go on "thin". I found it very forgiving when spraying. I started to get a few places where run started. But after the part hung for a few minutes, it all evened out very nicely. Spray the tight spots first, then go back and cover the easy areas.
Word to the dense (like me). The parts look dull and dry after about 5 minutes. DO NOT TOUCH THEM. They are not dry and you will leave a finger print. Ask me how I know.
Finally, put the parts in a 250 degrees F oven for two hours to cure. If your oven is know accurate, great, if not, get an oven thermometer and validate it. I used the house oven and there was no real smell at all. Take out all the racks but one, and put it at the very top and hang parts from it. Test hanging them several times before you start the prep/park/spary process. I still learned things when I finally when to put them in, but luckily didn't smudge them.
While they cook, clean up all the cerakote with acetone, and put the park solution in a jug to save. You can re-use it for several projects before it is spent. As it ages the part will become less dark. When you feel it isn't giving the color you want, replace or recharge the solution. Add water as needed to keep the volume about the same.
After the two hours in the oven, let the part cool and re-assemble the gun. I facilitated cooling with some water at the sink cause I am not patient.
(http://fellingfamily.net/images/witnessComplete.jpg)
I started this about 8:00 AM, having already done the sand blasting a few days earlier. I was done with the gun back together about 6 hours later. This is not really that challenging if you are a do-it-yourself kinda guy. I plan on doing lots more, so I bought more park solution than I needed for just this project. If you already have sprayers and sandblast equipment, this will run you about $60.00 in park solution (16 oz) and cerakote ($40 starter kit) and would be enough to do probably 4-6 handguns or 2-3 rifles.
One final benefit is the slide to frame fit is much, much tighter now. The Cerakote is about .001" thick they say. But that is X4 since you have two rails and two grooves that get coated. +.004" and you can tell.
If you are handy and already have most of the tools, this is not that hard and can save a fair bit of money versus paying to have it done.
Lets see some pics!
I'm surprised you put cerakote on the guide rod and barrel; I wouldn't think it will take very long before that wears through and looks bad.
Quote from: Yondering on July 23 2012 10:52:08 AM MDT
Lets see some pics!
I'm surprised you put cerakote on the guide rod and barrel; I wouldn't think it will take very long before that wears through and looks bad.
Sorry, post got cut off at the degree's sign. Amended and now with the pic of the completed gun.
I have seen some shots online of a gun with a cerakoted barrel with 4,000+ round through it. It has worn a little, but still looked fine. And the rails looked like new. Hoping I did as good a job!
Good job. Thanks for taking the time to post the details and photos.
That turned out awesome! 8)
Yeah, that looks pretty good. Nice work.
Nice, good job man. :)
Very nicely done! looks great!
So the parkerizing turned the metal black, what did you need Cerakote for? Was is a clear coat?
Quote from: Grim Reaper on June 13 2013 10:10:14 AM MDTSo the parkerizing turned the metal black, what did you need Cerakote for? Was is a clear coat?
I think because;Quote from: sqlbullet on July 13 2012 10:09:38 AM MDTPlan is to make my first go on my full size Witness. I have never been a fan of the Wonder finish. It now has a couple spots where it surface rusted and I had to polish the rust back out. So,...
Parkerizing by itself provides no corrosion protection. It makes the surface of the steel much harder and durable to wear, and it makes the surface layer slightly porous. But if you parkerize steel, neutralize it and leave it it will rust VERY quickly.
Usually after parkerizing, the steel is coated with a grease, oil or wax, or a compound made of us those items. This soaks into the newly created pores and provides lubricity and rust protection. Great of gear that is carried on the shoulder, or in a OWB fully cover holster.
But for IWB carry next to the body, you have to be meticulous in re-applying lubricant.
My solution was to cerakote it. The cerakote, in addition to provide great lubricity, also protects from corrosion by keeping air away from the steel.
So, that is the why.