/flame suit on :o
could it be done? with a mechtech or longslide and a HOT, HOT, HOT hardcast load?
My uncle invited me to stay with him up in AK for a little while to get some work around the place. he said he'd take me moose hunting ;D I'm by far most comfortable with my mech tech and g20 as far as being able to hit a target.
Could it be done? Sure.
Advisable? No.
At best, no more than a back-up weapon, or extremely close range with no better option available in a survival situation. I wouldn't do it, on purpose. No way. They don't go down easy with big magnum rifles, as it is. Any story to the contrary is the exception, not the rule, or just a story.
Quote from: DM1906 on August 01 2013 04:50:27 PM MDT
Could it be done? Sure.
Advisable? No.
At best, no more than a back-up weapon, or extremely close range with no better option available in a survival situation. I wouldn't do it, on purpose. No way. They don't go down easy with big magnum rifles, as it is. Any story to the contrary is the exception, not the rule, or just a story.
Oh really? I didn't realize they were so tough, I thought they were just a lot bigger, not necessarily much tougher/harder to kill than a whitetail
Moose are up there with the largest, most aggressive, territorial, and toughest kills on this continent. Nothing remotely close to scrawny little whitetails. 3rd, after polar and brown bears, but not by much.
They kill them with archery equipment.
Mechtech and a good 200 grain hard cast or that Hawk i just tested would be a good round would it be enough if you are close and you put inot the boiler room should be. Respect the limitations but really I would take something else. Like a good 358 Winchester, 338 Win Mag, 375 H&H.
.... And the natives killed them with spears, sticks and stones. There were, however, a bunch of hunters in the party, and their motives were quite different.
Archery is a completely different game. I've yet to hear of any DRT kills with an arrow (not that they've never happened, just I haven't heard). Most are never found.
At best, you'll be able to top about 900 FPE, and a KO of 16, at the muzzle. That doesn't get you half way there for either. At even 25 yds, it's dismal. The 10mm Auto is a lot of things, but it just doesn't fit in this picture. The bullet won't matter as much as a dozen other factors, which also don't fall in your favor.
Did you read my last sentence?
I did, and no offense intended. It seems you get it, and I didn't mean to insult your intelligence.
Just continuing the discussion, as to why I think it's a really bad idea to rely on the 10mm for this. Just trying to keep it real.
No problem , I agree with you lots of much better choices especially in handguns.
460 S&W
500 S&W
475 Linebaugh
Even the 454 Is a much better choice in a handgun.
Then consider the many great wildcats and TC contenders.
Yup 10mm really really bad choice.
If you get close, use good ammo and bullets, pick your shots and make them good, the 10 will do the job just fine...
Like most animals in the USA the 30-30 has killed more than any others. Its of allot less power then the ''experts'' say is needed too. :o :o :D
CW
yea but CW with my suggestion he has and excuse to go buy another handgun and that my friend is a good thing.
I would air on the side of be humane and use something else besides the 10mm anything! Bragging rights don't = humane kills! Sorry! >:( If you're on a trophy hunt, don't screw it up by wounding the animal and possible loosing it because it ran off. May run to an un-accessible area, where you may not retrieve it. ??? Could it be done yes! There is a video of a moose being shoot with a 10mm. (can seem to put my mouse on it) There was a guy that shot a moose that was terrorizing his dog, using the Glock 20 with FMJ's, he was questioned by Alaska State Troopers in the show.
All that said, If I was hungry and it was all I had to shoot with, I would take my chances with the 10mm.
Quote from: cwlongshot on August 02 2013 03:45:35 AM MDT
If you get close, use good ammo and bullets, pick your shots and make them good, the 10 will do the job just fine...
Like most animals in the USA the 30-30 has killed more than any others. Its of allot less power then the ''experts'' say is needed too. :o :o :D
CW
Just how close do you really want to get to a 7 foot tall (shoulders), 1,500 pound bull? Alaskan moose are of the largest on Earth. I wouldn't hunt moose with a .30-30, not that you couldn't. Still, it has more than twice the bullet energy of the healthiest of healthy 10mm Auto. Comparing moose to any common "deer" is just silly. Cows aren't as large as bulls, but still at least 3-4X that of any whitetail, and all attitude if she's got a calf nearby. Bulls don't need a reason. If you're close enough to get a pistol shot (with something as puny as the 10mm), you're too close. You won't have enough bullets, and you're dead before you reload. This animal can run at 30 MPH for 100 yds, after having it's lungs blown out. I don't mean any disrespect to anyone in this discussion, but it's just silly. A wrong turn here will get you killed. Moose kill more people than black bear, brown bear, grizz, and wolves combined. Probably gators and sharks too, but I don't recall hearing about them in the stats. I haven't checked, but it may not even be legal to hunt moose with an auto pistol, for the reason Shadow pointed out. Many/most states have minimum power requirements for taking game.
An exaggeration? Perhaps, but just a little.
Quote from: gofastman on August 01 2013 10:58:39 AM MDTcould it be done?
Yes.
Quotewith a mechtech or longslide and a HOT, HOT, HOT hardcast load?
Yes, but not necessary to that extent. A 200XTP @ 1200 FPS or more should work with proper shot placement too. It's my understanding that Elk have tougher hide/muscle/bone to penetrate than moose. And it's not like all Bull Moose are 1500 pounds either. Adult Alaskan Bull Moose RANGE from 1000-1600 pounds. Of course that's not to say you won't end up running into the one that hits 1601 pounds. And with some beginners luck, who's to say. 8)
QuoteMy uncle invited me to stay with him up in AK for a little while to get some work around the place. he said he'd take me moose hunting ;D I'm by far most comfortable with my mech tech and g20 as far as being able to hit a target.
Sounds awesome with a chance of a lifetime opportunity. I know I'ld love to hear your
Moose VS 10mm success story no matter what anyone else says. That will be waaaaaaaay more exciting than all the everyday Whitetail Deer stories and such!
You'll certainly want to be prepared physically, mentally, and equipment wise, but at the end of the day if you set your mind to it you should have at least a fair chance of success without getting dead in the process. Sometimes it more difficult fighting off the wolves and grizzlys after the kill. ;D
Anyway, if it works out, Good Luck!
Thanks for the input everyone, I appreciate the calm, informative responses.
I have been to AK a few times before and I have seen quite a few moose, but I dont have any experience with hunting game bigger than jackrabbit (shot it with an AK74, funny story) or the killing power of the 10
I guess Id better load up a few hundred mild .454 rounds and put in some seat time with the Super Redhawk.
Maybe a .454 Rossi would be a good purchase :D I have also been pondering a .480 SRH
I wish somebody made a DA .475 Maximum
Quote from: gofastman on August 05 2013 11:02:31 AM MDTI wish somebody made a DA .475 Maximum.
Quote from: gofastman on August 05 2013 08:58:30 AM MDTI guess Id better load up a few hundred mild .454 rounds and put in some seat time with the Super Redhawk. Maybe a .454 Rossi would be a good purchase :D I have also been pondering a .480 SRH.
There really are some great big bore super magnum level options out there. Of course the 454 Casull as you've mentioned. 475 & 500 Linebaugh offerings, 460 & 500 S&W offerings, 500 Wyoming Express by Freedom Arms, other Maximums and Super Mags, and the Magnum Research BFR revolvers that you can buy chambered in: 30-30 Wichester, 444 Marlin, 45-70 Gov't, 450 Marlin, and numerous others, some of which were mentioned already, and others not.
You're right though, not much available out there in DA. Doesn't bother me, but to each their own. 8)
Quote from: Ramjet on August 02 2013 08:19:39 AM MDT
yea but CW with my suggestion he has and excuse to go buy another handgun and that my friend is a good thing.
RIGHT ON BROTHER!! An ''excuse'' is all many of us need!!! :o :o :P :P :P :D :D :D
CW
Quote from: DM1906 on August 02 2013 09:29:17 AM MDT
Quote from: cwlongshot on August 02 2013 03:45:35 AM MDT
If you get close, use good ammo and bullets, pick your shots and make them good, the 10 will do the job just fine...
Like most animals in the USA the 30-30 has killed more than any others. Its of allot less power then the ''experts'' say is needed too. :o :o :D
CW
Just how close do you really want to get to a 7 foot tall (shoulders), 1,500 pound bull? Alaskan moose are of the largest on Earth. I wouldn't hunt moose with a .30-30, not that you couldn't. Still, it has more than twice the bullet energy of the healthiest of healthy 10mm Auto. Comparing moose to any common "deer" is just silly. Cows aren't as large as bulls, but still at least 3-4X that of any whitetail, and all attitude if she's got a calf nearby. Bulls don't need a reason. If you're close enough to get a pistol shot (with something as puny as the 10mm), you're too close. You won't have enough bullets, and you're dead before you reload. This animal can run at 30 MPH for 100 yds, after having it's lungs blown out. I don't mean any disrespect to anyone in this discussion, but it's just silly. A wrong turn here will get you killed. Moose kill more people than black bear, brown bear, grizz, and wolves combined. Probably gators and sharks too, but I don't recall hearing about them in the stats. I haven't checked, but it may not even be legal to hunt moose with an auto pistol, for the reason Shadow pointed out. Many/most states have minimum power requirements for taking game.
An exaggeration? Perhaps, but just a little.
I have been very close to Moose MANY TIMES! They surely can be dangerous but they are NOT A PREDATOR, WE are and THEY know it! The bulls do get a bit belligerent during the rut, sure. ;D (My Loose knowledge is on Maine/Canada Moose.)
I have never herd your stats on moose human kills, I feel you have miss read something tho. I will say this about Moose killing humans, they DO usually win a car moose collision... They usually have to be put down as the car breaks there legs as they are usually above the hoods. Out right attacks of a moose chasing down and killing a human are not so common.
Don't fool yourself for one moment, the 10MM WILL put them down. They are NOT hard to kill.
CW
That's almost humorous right there. You're comparing your experience with east coast moose to Alaskan species. That's like comparing a spaniel to a bull mastiff (they're both dogs, but hardly the same) 600-800# vs. 1300-1600#, with accordingly proportionate attitudes. Both comparisons equally capable of aggressive behavior, with capabilities proportionate to their mass. And no, they aren't "not hard to kill". Add to that, moose ain't the only dangerous critters in Alaska, unlike your neck of the woods. The "stats" are correct, and don't include vehicle vs. animals. "Aggressive encounters" is the term, I believe, which may include animal vs. vehicle, which isn't the same. Bovine bulls and goats aren't predators either, but they don't charge because they're out of cash.
More power to ya.
No need to get your feathers ruffled! :o NO OFFENSE meant brother we are just talking here!!!
1600# Alaska Moose is a REAR breed, ??? but 1000+ Easterns DRESSED have become common place... Been around them my hole life.
http://www.maine.gov/ifw/wildlife/species/moose/
We even Chased a big cow with a calf out of the yard, just this AM... :D This one went easy, one time we had to use the truck. Most you just bang a couple pans together, the ornery ones I send the dog. ;D ;D
CW
QuoteThis one went easy, one time we had to use the truck. Most you just bang a couple pans together, the ornery ones I send the dog
Bull Mastif....... ;D
I would use my handloads on moose. I don't think I would use factory ammo. I personally would use a 205 gr flat nose at 1400 fps. More than enough.
Quote from: Ramjet on August 07 2013 06:43:09 PM MDT
QuoteThis one went easy, one time we had to use the truck. Most you just bang a couple pans together, the ornery ones I send the dog
Bull Mastif....... ;D
LOL... 140# Rott ;D ;D
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/CWLONGSHOT/Temp%20stuff/RILEY/RileyJan05.jpg)
This is a queen sized bed..
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/CWLONGSHOT/Temp%20stuff/RILEY/Favoriteposition.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/CWLONGSHOT/Temp%20stuff/RILEY/RileygrowlI.jpg)
CW
Saw a recent episode of Alaskan state troopers. Guy called in and told the dispatcher he just shot and killed 2 moose who were attacking his dog. Trooper showed up and the guy had killed both moose with a glock 10 mm. And had lots of bullets to spare
A properly placed shot with a 180 + grain 10mm will definitely take down about anything.
The question is can you make the shot under extreme pressure? ;D
Quote from: taters on August 14 2013 08:42:47 PM MDT
Saw a recent episode of Alaskan state troopers. Guy called in and told the dispatcher he just shot and killed 2 moose who were attacking his dog. Trooper showed up and the guy had killed both moose with a glock 10 mm. And had lots of bullets to spare
I remember that now! I knew I had seen somewhere that much be it.. IIRC it was even FMJ bullets!!
There was blood and moose carcases in his drive way!!! They where attacking his dog IIRC.
CW
Watched an episode of. True stories of Alaskan state troopers. A guy called in saying his dog was attacked by two moose. He killed them both with a glock 20. With bullets to spare in the magazine. They hauled away the moose to a food bank.
I spent 35 years in Alaska and during that time took at least 2 dozen moose. Most with a bow.
1 If there are plenty of moose to provide you with lots of opportunities
2 and you have lots of time to hunt
3 and you are proficient with your 10mm
there should be no problem.
However,....like Elmer Keith once said, "If your family is hungry and the only shot you get is the rear end of an Elk as he jumps up and runs away from you, use a gun capable of driving a bullet through the hindquarters and still have enough energy left to destroy the vitals. " Of course, I paraphrase.
If you only have time for one opportunity - forget it.
If you aren't good at stalking (to get into range & position) - forget it.
If you can't pass up everything but the perfect shot placement - forget it.
(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d98/leflers/1012no310mm_zps50b1c7e7.jpg) (http://s33.photobucket.com/user/leflers/media/1012no310mm_zps50b1c7e7.jpg.html)
I have shot Alaskan moose with revolvers before. The problem is not killing the moose it is stopping it from going somewhere you don't it to go, for example, a swamp or river.
Pick your shot and hit him in a lung and it will die eventually but will wander around for maybe miles. I've used a 454 casull but in the future would use either my 475 Linebaugh or a 500 JRH.
Quote from: bustedknee on September 26 2013 10:45:54 PM MDT
If you only have time for one opportunity - forget it.
If you aren't good at stalking (to get into range & position) - forget it.
If you can't pass up everything but the perfect shot placement - forget it.
How succinctly you put the reasons why I suck at hunting... ;-)
Too late for input to OP but here is my perspective. Unless you are hunting with relative, brother or similar , nonresident requires licensed guide. All that aside, moose have big lungs, unlike whitetails. I have lung shots two 700 lb plus cows, elk and water buffalo. My typical deer is shot behind the shoulder, with 20 yard dash being typical. The cows just tried to stay with the herd, requiring multiple hard cast bullets. The first cow was with a 44 Special, 240 grain SWC at 1000 fps from 4 inch S&W Model 24. The second was with a Redhawk .45 Colt using RCBS #452-270-SAA at 1050 fps. The second 44 special stopped under the skin on the left shoulder after angling forward from behind the right shoulder. She did drop at the shot. The second cow took four side to side lung shots before going down at about 40 yards from the first shot. This isn't really too different from my limited bull elk reaction from a 308 Winchester or 35 Whelen for another cow elk. Have a heavy rifle as backup, get close, keep shooting through the front of the chest, not just behind the shoulder like deer. I would pick the 480 Ruger Super Redhawk with a red dot as my primary handgun and carry the Glock 20 with 200 grain hard cast bullets at 1200 fps as backup. A .45 ACP with 230 grain hardball from a 1911 semiautomatic will kill a moose up close with neck shots, but not a first choice, more like a cow or me situation.
Quote from: DM1906 on August 01 2013 08:06:58 PM MDT
Archery is a completely different game. I've yet to hear of any DRT kills with an arrow (not that they've never happened, just I haven't heard). Most are never found.
Unless you happen to be the legendary Fred Bear.http://bowsite.com/BOWSITE/features/articles/UNFORGETTABLE/fredbear/ (http://bowsite.com/BOWSITE/features/articles/UNFORGETTABLE/fredbear/)
Quote from: Zephyr on March 02 2014 06:12:50 PM MST
Quote from: DM1906 on August 01 2013 08:06:58 PM MDT
Archery is a completely different game. I've yet to hear of any DRT kills with an arrow (not that they've never happened, just I haven't heard). Most are never found.
Unless you happen to be the legendary Fred Bear.
http://bowsite.com/BOWSITE/features/articles/UNFORGETTABLE/fredbear/ (http://bowsite.com/BOWSITE/features/articles/UNFORGETTABLE/fredbear/)
I have seen a few. But they are not as common and require perfect impact point.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fy_b7_dbNw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aAqnprt9ZG8
CW