Hello all,
I've had the 10mm bug for awhile. I'm an experienced handloader, and the 10mm has a certain draw to it...the idea of .357 level loads in a semi-auto - I love it. But I digress.
If I buy a 10mm, I'm not interested in using loads that are barely stronger than .40S&W, so I want something that will handle the full-house "nuclear" stuff. For awhile, I've been watching S&W 1006s on auctions, as I know they'll handle whatever you feed them. But they're not super common, and I like the looks of the Witness, which seems to be a few hundred $ less.
So, to the heart of the matter: I've seen posts on Witness slide cracks...read a few comments like "I'd never fire a 10mm Witness", etc. Are Witnesses safe for use with hot 10mm loads?
Looks to me like the "rounded" slide is the type prone to cracking? But the square style on the Witness Match would be safe?
Or should I just pony up for a 1006? Thanks.
Well, I started with the S&W 1006 in 1990 and it is still going strong!
About the EAA Witness guns, it has been the contoured slides that have had the prone to cracking issues, the heavier type slides don't seem to be affected. One of the forum's memebrs, Intercooler, has run just about every type ammo that is or was available thru his EAA Hunter and Match pistols. 8)
My squared slide Witnesses shoot anything. Buffalo Bore, Underwood and my own nuclear handloads. No problems.
You mention the Witness Match. The Match is a single action firearm for target shooting. Your choices in double action are the Limited Pro, The Stock, Stock 2, any of the polymer versions or the base model steel Witness.
Just stay away from the compacts,they are not suitable for heavy stuff.
If you get the squared side versions no issues. My Hunter has seen 900lb loads and my Match 800lb loads and tons of extreme 10's without any issues. They both still look brand new and never a busted part except sights. You may want to opt for fixed sights or just swap to the Henning pieces. Put a Henning flat bottom firing pin block and cone guide-rod in for even more beef.
I have a 1006 too.
Here is a review I did on my four :o
http://10mm-firearms.com/10mm-semi-auto-handguns/review-of-my-four-10's-(sw-1006-eaa-match-eaa-hunter-dan-wesson-razorback)/
I have the S&W 1006 and several of the EAA Witness 10MM (slab sided) pistols. I have shot just about every kind of bullet in them with NO problems of any kind.
You might want to consider a Rock Island 1911 FS VZ 10 mm. They are a pretty full feature 10 in a 1911 package. The only items I have seem talked about are the need to go to a 22lb recoil spring. I know Rock Island/Armscor CS is outstanding. You should be able to find one in the $600 range, new, if you shop around. I'll admit I lean toward 1911s, but have owned both EEA Witnesses (2), and S&W autos (4), but what you buy is always a personal preference.
I have or had: Witness Match, G20, RIA 1911, and original Delta Elite.
Witness Match: brand new it pig bellied the factory brass so bad it couldn't be reloaded. EAA refused to do anything about it. GONE
Delta Elite: I really loved that gun....but it cracked under factory loads. GONE
RIA: Really like this one but I did install 22# recoil spring,FBFP stop, and heavy mainspring.
G20: Installed Storm Lake match barrel and it eats ALL loads and keeps on going.
I don't think the 1911 is designed to take a steady diet of max/over max loads. Its my CCW and I don't need hunting loads in it. A 180 GD at 1275fps is more than enough. My G20 has digested some stupidly hot loads with no problems. If you can find a SW, that seems to be the best firearm for your needs. Or the G20 with a quality aftermarket barrel will do it.
Best of luck on your hunt.
Dennis
As far as I know, EAA fixed the cracking problems. I would only be real leery if I bought a used one.
Quote from: denclaste on June 23 2013 09:24:41 AM MDT
I have or had: Witness Match, G20, RIA 1911, and original Delta Elite.
Witness Match: brand new it pig bellied the factory brass so bad it couldn't be reloaded. EAA refused to do anything about it. GONE
Delta Elite: I really loved that gun....but it cracked under factory loads. GONE
RIA: Really like this one but I did install 22# recoil spring,FBFP stop, and heavy mainspring.
G20: Installed Storm Lake match barrel and it eats ALL loads and keeps on going.
I don't think the 1911 is designed to take a steady diet of max/over max loads. Its my CCW and I don't need hunting loads in it. A 180 GD at 1275fps is more than enough. My G20 has digested some stupidly hot loads with no problems. If you can find a SW, that seems to be the best firearm for your needs. Or the G20 with a quality aftermarket barrel will do it.
Best of luck on your hunt.
Dennis
Agreed. That pretty well sums it up. Though I do believe 1911s set up correctly are perfectly fine for a steady diet of hot 10mm.
BTW, Welcome to the forum Breeder!
I personally use a Gen 3 G20 with a 6" Storm Lake barrel.
While I agree with Gandog that EAA /Tanfoglio has addressed the heat treat issue on the slides, I don't agree that means you are safe with a NIB gun.
Problem is, unlike cars, a NIB gun can linger at a gun dealer, or in a warehouse, for some time.
If I bought a rounded slide Witness, I would probably run lots of Underwood through it to make the crack reveal itself. That gets the warranty work done and over with sooner, rather than later.
If it stands up to 1000 rounds of Underwood, then it is probably not one fo the slides with the heat treat issue.
Quote from: sqlbullet on June 26 2013 09:26:31 AM MDTProblem is, unlike cars, a NIB gun can linger at a gun dealer, or in a warehouse, for some time.
Very good point. That's exactly the reason I don't mind a run (buying frenzy) on shooting related stuff every so often. Namely: Firearms, Powder, Primers,... Then, when I do buy, it's not usually from a small retailer, but rather from someone like Graf & Sons/Cabela's/Midway/...
Don't get me wrong, I don't entirely leave Mom & Pop shops out to dry, I'm just more careful with some specific items.
I have a rounded slide witness that has been beefed up a bit with the following:
Sprinco Rod
22lb mainspring
18lb recoil spring
Hennings flat bottom firing pin stop
I really only run hot (book max) handloads through the thing
I'll let you know when it cracks ;D